Conspiracy! The Show 162: Derren Brown and the Bobby Kennedy Experiment

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I went through the transparent.
You just hold on.

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Hey, everybody, Welcome to
conspiracy the show.

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I’m Adam, Todd Brown and I’m
Olivia, hide our and we are your

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host this week.
This is a free episode.

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Wow, enjoy it.
Everybody, its kind of spawned

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from the last two bonus episodes
we did, which we did back to

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back because my Agile dictated
that.

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We must put up two bonus
episodes in a way.

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So you just can’t get enough.
Can’t get enough of one episode

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of Jesse, Ventura’s conspiracy
theory like no.

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No, you gotta honestly, I, it’s
all I want to do now, is watch

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episodes, Conspiracy Theory with
Jesse Ventura and yeah, we cup

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we covered last week in episode
about Manchurian candidates.

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Yeah, still still a title that I
have issues with.

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Yeah, which is incorrectly
defined on Conspiracy Theory

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with Jesse Ventura as programmed
assassins.

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And that is not what I was
movies are about.

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I mean, yeah, that mean like
just not in the way that they

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thought.
Anyway, it’s a specific thing.

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I’m just saying the major ink is
specific and one of the things

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that comes up in that episode is
the assassination of Robert, F

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Kennedy, right?
Which is a thing.

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We’ve done an episode about and
we’re doing another episode

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about it today but not in its
entirety.

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We’re focusing on one Theory as
it pertains to the assassination

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of Robert F Kennedy and one very
particular incident when it

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comes to the theory about Robert
F Kennedy’s assassination which

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is Darren Brown’s episode of a
TV show called the experiments

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right?
Where he tries to reproduce the

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Acts of Sirhan Sirhan,
basically.

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Yes.
And he’s, it’s a thing.

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It’s a thing.
I’ve mentioned on this podcast a

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lot, so, it’s fitting right?
That were going to do an episode

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about it, which it’s a thing.
You can watch on YouTube

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willing, get it’s up there.
But, uh, we should talk about

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Darren Brown first, did you have
any familiarity with him before

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we started doing this episode?
I had only, I had not really

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seen anything of his like in
totality, you know?

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No II.
But I was aware of him as an

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individual just through a few of
his stunts.

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I seen a couple things that were
not related to like the YouTube

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that he had done like in Los
Angeles but but yeah, no not not

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particularly, but I did for the
episode watch, several a few

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different things just to kind of
get more of a clear picture of

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what kind of Entertainer me is.
Yeah, I had only Seen the

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Netflix specials before this,
he’s got three Netflix specials

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which we’ll talk about in a
minute but beyond that, I didn’t

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realize how far back his history
of doing this kind of stuff

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goes.
Yeah, he’s huge in Britain, when

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you, when you look them up, like
I was looking through like

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reviews and forums about his
older stuff and he is a, he’s

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extremely well known in Britain
like that.

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He’s like one of their biggest
Additions.

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Yeah.
He’s like David Icke huge.

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Yeah, yeah, exactly.
I’ve seen him described as the

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David Blaine of England and I
don’t think that’s completely

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accurate.
Yeah, I mean, David Blaine is

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more physical stuff.
Yes.

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I can’t picture Derren.
Brown having himself suspended

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above Times Square in a block
race or whatever the fuck.

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I don’t I don’t think that that
comparison.

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Like as far as like, the actual
Themselves or the or the

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Illusions or whatever that they
do are comparable.

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But I would say like as a career
Arc and also, as the kind of

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performer that they both seem to
be that that that was a

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comparison that came to my mind
while I was watching all this

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stuff because you know David
Blaine started out doing, you

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know like close-up magic and a
lot of let street magic that was

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his like that was his big thing.
It became like almost a joke and

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Then transitioned into these
more, elaborate things that

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required a lot more production
work and a lot more setups and

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became a lot more easily
noticeable as being kind of

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phony and we’re and Derren
Brown.

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You know, he hasn’t done gone in
the physical Direction but you

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know he started out doing
close-up magic card tricks and

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stuff and has kind of transition
to doing now these Elaborate

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production heavy, psychological
based tricks which basically

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feel like prank shows at this
point like it’s just I’ve

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transitioned feel like with some
of his stuff it’s almost worse

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than prank shows.
Oh yeah, definitely it’s

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definitely way like somehow less
ethical than a prank show.

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I I also went and watched some
of his other stuff once we

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started researching this, And
I’m halfway through one called

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Aaron Browns apocalypse.
Oh yes, yeah.

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And he just takes a guy and
convinces him.

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That the world is ending right
in an effort, to make him a

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better person and I’m like, you
are torturing this man.

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Yeah, I mean, that’s that’s the
thing.

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And there’s also another one
called Hero at 30,000 feet where

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he convinces a person that he is
on a plane.

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He’s really in a like simulated
plane environment and then you

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know makes them like laying the
plane or you know and so yeah

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like again like these have way
more in common with a prank show

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than a magic trick or a
psychological experiment as a

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psychological experiment, they
are not particularly useful.

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Well it depends on what one
you’re watching though.

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Because you’re right the thing
is He kind of runs the gamut,

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it’s not all psychological
experiments.

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He spends a lot of time,
debunking things like Faith,

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healers, and psychics, who claim
to be able to cold read people.

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He’s got whole specials that are
like, now, that’s not magic.

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It’s just, it’s a, it’s a
technique people.

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Yes, he seems to go in easy to
sit like have the same kind of

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company as like, James Randi,
and Penn and Teller.

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These guys who are extremely
talented magicians to the point

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where they are basically experts
in that in that field of

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trickery and illusion and then
use that knowledge to debunk

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things that are purporting to be
actually Supernatural.

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Yeah.
He is very controversial.

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Yes.
Like there’s, there’s a special

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that came out on Netflix that
we’ll talk about more in a

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second called the push.
And when that came out, people

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wanted him and the participants
arrested because it’s like, I do

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Chi, get the prank show Vibes
but it’s like remember Scare

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Tactics yet that I’ve been
thinking about Scare Tactics as

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well.
It’s like Scare Tactics but

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worse especially the push.
Yeah, because oral Scare

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Tactics.
Yeah.

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It’s it’s like what if you were
on Scare Tactics and then you

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came away from That questioning
everything about who you are as

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a person, right?
Exactly.

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And again, like, this is, you
know, this is something that

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will definitely be talking about
more, but like, the, he frames

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this all around it, with a
psychological kind of bent,

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where he’s framing it as like a
social experiment or whatever.

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When and it does push people to
the limits of, you know, social

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acceptability.
T and whatnot but I the tactics

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are like like we’re saying
basically scare tactics on Syfy

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channel, like you expect Tracy
Morgan to jump out at any moment

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or something.
Yeah, there’s just a lot of

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hypnotism mixed in which yes,
yes.

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Um, especially in the apocalypse
thing, right?

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Because at one point, he has
that guy basically in the

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opening scene of The Walking
Dead like he puts him under gets

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him in a hospital.
Add handcuffs him to it and then

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is like, wake up and the guys
just in this empty hospital room

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with a fake news report about
the apocalypse playing and it’s

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like, this is fun, but anyone in
that situation would feel like

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the apocalypse.
Like, here’s what is terrifying

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about that episode and we should
cover that, too, because it’s a

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two-hour thing.
It’s not what Derren Brown is

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able to do in that episode.
It’s what the British government

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is able to do one of the the
things they do to.

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This guy is hack, his phone in a
way that lets them put fake news

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stories on legitimate websites.
So he pulls up the bbc.com and

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sees a story about how a meteor
shower is about to destroy

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Earth.
Yeah.

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And it’s like, why would you not
believe it?

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They do like the fake radio
broadcasts of shows he listens

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to, and it’s like, of course,
he’s kind of think the

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apocalypse is about to happen
here.

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Crafting an apocalypse around
him.

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Right?
Exactly.

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Well in this to me, is gets to
the kind of at a heart of what

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his work kind of post in the
last 10 to 15.

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And then tend to like 13 years
has been is basically like these

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extremely elaborate setups to
elicit a specific response from

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either one person or a small
group of people.

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Yeah.
Because like you said, like,

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Like if like, yeah, if you are
put into a scenario, that is

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that comprehensive, then you
don’t really have any choice to

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the other than to believe that
that’s what’s going on.

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Yeah, and I mean, he’s been
doing this since 2000.

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At least on television, he’s
been right warming since 92,

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right?
But he’s been doing this on TV

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since 2000.
So he’s got to be like,

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eventually he’s going to have
that David Copperfield.

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Make The Statue of Liberty
disappear thing, right?

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Right people like what that
said, some of what he does

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reminds me of a David
Copperfield special.

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I watched where he put up four
cards on the screen and like

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talks you through this
progression and at the end.

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He’s like here’s the card.
Your finger is on right and it

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fucking worked on TV.
So like there’s obviously

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tricks.
And techniques you can use to in

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your words to get people, to do
what you want.

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It’s just that what Derren Brown
does.

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Isn’t always that right.
Well but also it should be

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stated, he also does he does
live stage shows in addition to

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his televised and filmed work
in.

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Those are from what I’ve heard.
Again I haven’t been to been to

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see him but there are very
different in structure and are

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more closely related to
traditional illusion show,

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right?
Or a mentalist show.

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They don’t have the same sort of
elaborate production value, but

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most of his TV work has been
focusing on that and yeah, you

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know, it’s it’s just
interesting.

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I some of it is some of its more
engaging than others.

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I’m not like particularly, you
know, I like I said, I like

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magic and that sort of thing but
I’m not a particular fan of

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mentalism in general.
Just because there’s I don’t

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know, it seems much sloppier
than State and like, like

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sleight-of-hand magic and that
sort of thing.

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But but but I actually did watch
a card trick that he did.

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And yeah, it was a similar sort
of vibe where it’s like having

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someone, you know, stop counting
a card.

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And then he has written the card
ahead of time and and that sort

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of thing.
And, you know, it’s he isn’t he

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is kind of like David Blaine in
that way where yeah, a lot of

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David Blaine’s.
Really big stunts.

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I’m like, I’m sorry even if In a
black eye.

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So I’m not going to wash you for
16 hours right.

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This is like mostly boring but
when you get David Blaine doing

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card tricks.
Yeah he’s great he’s in his

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fucking Zone that.
Have you ever seen the Harrison?

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Ford is literally just bout the
mention.

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The Harrison Ford Orange video
which is amazing.

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It is so great.
Harrison Ford at the end is like

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get the fuck out of my house,
Harrison Ford like it’s one of

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his better performances in the
last 20 years.

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Yeah but yeah though it’s super
great and but like going along

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with like what you were saying
about his, you know, David

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00:14:03,500 –> 00:14:07,500
Blaine like you know, with video
editing their, you know.

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I don’t want to sit and watch
you being a nice for hours, you

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know, he had a thing where
Darren Brennan the thing where

216
00:14:13,500 –> 00:14:19,700
he flipped a coin and got heads
10 times in a row and yeah, but

217
00:14:19,800 –> 00:14:23,400
but the thing, but yeah, he
filmed for like hours until he

218
00:14:23,400 –> 00:14:25,800
got.
In heads in a row.

219
00:14:25,800 –> 00:14:30,600
Like that’s just and there was
another big one where he guessed

220
00:14:30,600 –> 00:14:33,200
Lottery winning lottery numbers,
right?

221
00:14:33,200 –> 00:14:38,100
And then that was later revealed
to be a split camera technique

222
00:14:38,100 –> 00:14:40,600
where he just knew what the
numbers are going to be

223
00:14:40,600 –> 00:14:43,000
beforehand and these sorts of
things.

224
00:14:43,000 –> 00:14:46,900
So like I don’t like he’s again,
I don’t want to take anything

225
00:14:46,900 –> 00:14:50,900
away from his talents as a
magician or Entertainer like

226
00:14:50,900 –> 00:14:53,500
everyone all magicians, use
these sorts of Tricks.

227
00:14:53,600 –> 00:14:56,200
Yeah.
But it’s the psychological

228
00:14:56,200 –> 00:15:00,000
framing that I think is that
muddies up that a little bit.

229
00:15:00,200 –> 00:15:06,100
Yeah, and he’s very prolific and
anyone who’s super prolific like

230
00:15:06,100 –> 00:15:08,100
Stephen.
King is a good example, not that

231
00:15:08,100 –> 00:15:12,400
I’m comparing Darren Brown and
Stephen King but Stephen King is

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00:15:12,400 –> 00:15:15,400
a home, run hitter and Home.
Run hitters strike out a lot.

233
00:15:15,600 –> 00:15:17,700
Yep.
So a lot of the things Stephen

234
00:15:17,700 –> 00:15:19,700
King has put out or not that
great.

235
00:15:19,900 –> 00:15:21,900
Yeah, when he’s great, he’s
really great.

236
00:15:22,000 –> 00:15:23,400
Yes.
And then when he’s bad he’s

237
00:15:23,400 –> 00:15:27,100
readable and Just like, when
even Derren Brown is not doing

238
00:15:27,100 –> 00:15:28,600
great.
He’s still watchable.

239
00:15:28,600 –> 00:15:33,700
Yeah and he’s put out a ton of
special since 2000.

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00:15:33,800 –> 00:15:38,100
Some of the more notable ones
Derren Brown plays Russian

241
00:15:38,100 –> 00:15:42,000
Roulette live guess what?
That one’s about Olivia I I’m

242
00:15:42,000 –> 00:15:47,700
gonna guess that maybe on on
like some sort of live TV he

243
00:15:47,900 –> 00:15:50,900
plays Russian Roulette.
I watched this last night and

244
00:15:50,900 –> 00:15:56,100
yeah I was wondering it.
Well, there’s a Video on his

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00:15:56,100 –> 00:15:59,900
page where it’s just the 10
minutes where he plays Russian

246
00:15:59,900 –> 00:16:04,400
Roulette, instead of the entire
setup of finding the guy who’s

247
00:16:04,400 –> 00:16:07,400
going to die and all this.
And it is actually very

248
00:16:07,400 –> 00:16:11,200
interesting and pretty.
And like, if you’ve seen deer

249
00:16:11,200 –> 00:16:15,300
hunter, you know, how intense
watching a person play Russian

250
00:16:15,300 –> 00:16:20,300
Roulette is and he does play
Russian Roulette and the thing

251
00:16:20,300 –> 00:16:24,700
is, this has been debunked.
Sure.

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00:16:25,000 –> 00:16:29,900
One by a guy who just said, well
I think this could be fake and

253
00:16:29,900 –> 00:16:34,000
it’s like well citation needed.
I need more information about

254
00:16:34,000 –> 00:16:37,300
why.
Like I understand it could be

255
00:16:37,300 –> 00:16:43,900
faked Reich, most of Television
is fake, but tell me why, right?

256
00:16:43,900 –> 00:16:48,500
And the other thing that came
out about this one, is that the

257
00:16:48,500 –> 00:16:51,100
bullets in the gun were blanks,
right?

258
00:16:51,200 –> 00:16:54,200
And so people are like, whoa, we
wasn’t going to die.

259
00:16:54,300 –> 00:16:57,700
Anyway, yeah it was.
Yeah I mean that yeah you shoot

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00:16:57,700 –> 00:17:01,200
yourself at close range with a
bullet filled with blanks.

261
00:17:01,200 –> 00:17:04,900
You’re going to die.
Yeah, just ask Brandon Lee how

262
00:17:05,300 –> 00:17:10,000
safe blanks are ya, or I
remember this story.

263
00:17:10,000 –> 00:17:14,099
So vividly it happened when I
was like, eight years old.

264
00:17:14,200 –> 00:17:19,200
Yeah, happened in. 1984, this
actor named John, Eric hexam.

265
00:17:19,200 –> 00:17:22,700
He was just some like, barely
known actor at the time, working

266
00:17:22,700 –> 00:17:27,800
on some show in Leigh, and there
was a break in the shooting.

267
00:17:28,700 –> 00:17:31,300
Poor choice of words.
There was a break in the filming

268
00:17:31,800 –> 00:17:35,000
and the scene they were just
filming was one where he has to

269
00:17:35,000 –> 00:17:39,400
load bullets into a 44 magnum.
So, they gave him a functioning

270
00:17:39,400 –> 00:17:43,100
gun and right blank rounds to
put in it.

271
00:17:43,100 –> 00:17:46,400
And then there’s this break in
filming and he starts getting

272
00:17:46,400 –> 00:17:50,000
all restless and starts playing
around with this fake gun on

273
00:17:50,000 –> 00:17:54,100
this idea and eventually opens
the chamber spins.

274
00:17:54,100 –> 00:17:57,700
It It shuts, it puts it to his
head, thinking he’s doing some

275
00:17:57,700 –> 00:18:02,300
jokey, jokes pulls the trigger.
It goes off and he fucking died.

276
00:18:02,300 –> 00:18:05,400
Yeah.
Because it still causes blunt

277
00:18:05,400 –> 00:18:07,200
force.
Trauma absent.

278
00:18:07,200 –> 00:18:11,500
Hey, yeah.
So had Derren Brown shot himself

279
00:18:11,500 –> 00:18:14,700
in the head with a blank, right?
You still would have seen a man

280
00:18:14,700 –> 00:18:16,300
die.
It might have just taken a few

281
00:18:16,300 –> 00:18:17,700
days.
Absolutely.

282
00:18:17,700 –> 00:18:21,700
And and you know, I for one
thing I want to say, don’t play

283
00:18:21,700 –> 00:18:25,600
around with a gun ever, like
just Is not like, if you have a

284
00:18:25,608 –> 00:18:29,700
gun Beast, you always have to
use a hold a gun as if, whatever

285
00:18:29,700 –> 00:18:33,100
its pointing at will die.
That’s just basic gun safety.

286
00:18:33,200 –> 00:18:35,800
Yeah, in that way.
The special is also very

287
00:18:35,800 –> 00:18:39,200
irresponsible sure.
But like, for the you for the

288
00:18:39,200 –> 00:18:42,000
sake of magic, but but, you
know, I want to say and because

289
00:18:42,000 –> 00:18:47,200
I’m gonna be kind of skeptical
and about a lot of stuff that we

290
00:18:47,208 –> 00:18:50,100
talked about on this program,
probably.

291
00:18:50,200 –> 00:18:54,600
But I want to say, I don’t think
the, I, the question of Of

292
00:18:54,600 –> 00:19:00,700
whether or not a specific trick
or Illusion was quote, unquote

293
00:19:00,700 –> 00:19:05,900
faked is a particularly
interesting question because

294
00:19:05,900 –> 00:19:09,900
that’s the entire point of a
magic trick is that it’s fake.

295
00:19:09,900 –> 00:19:14,600
Like obviously he was, he had a
way of playing Russian roulette

296
00:19:14,600 –> 00:19:17,900
that, we don’t know of that, you
know, worked out.

297
00:19:17,900 –> 00:19:22,800
And that’s fine, that’s how you
know magic where, you know, like

298
00:19:22,800 –> 00:19:26,500
a, I’m a big fan.
Of Penn and Teller, The

299
00:19:26,600 –> 00:19:34,400
Magicians not the Libertarians.
I went and saw them live in

300
00:19:34,400 –> 00:19:36,800
Vegas.
Once it was one of the greatest

301
00:19:36,800 –> 00:19:39,500
shows I’ve ever spent in my
life.

302
00:19:39,500 –> 00:19:44,200
It was fucking fantastic.
And they did their famous Magic

303
00:19:44,200 –> 00:19:46,700
Bullet trick, which I don’t know
if you’ve ever seen.

304
00:19:46,800 –> 00:19:49,200
Is that the one where they catch
it in the tea?

305
00:19:49,200 –> 00:19:50,900
Yeah, right.
Where they catch the bull in the

306
00:19:50,900 –> 00:19:55,300
teeth with a pane of glass
between them and A line on the

307
00:19:55,308 –> 00:19:57,500
ground that knowing no one
crosses.

308
00:19:57,700 –> 00:20:02,100
Its, it’s one of the most
amazing magic tricks out there.

309
00:20:02,100 –> 00:20:04,800
It’s spectacular.
You can watch it on YouTube.

310
00:20:04,800 –> 00:20:09,100
Highly recommend it and I have
no idea.

311
00:20:09,100 –> 00:20:15,500
I have no idea how that’s done,
but I know that it was done some

312
00:20:15,500 –> 00:20:18,000
way, like I know that it wasn’t
like real.

313
00:20:18,200 –> 00:20:21,400
You know, in the in the sense
that, you know, they actually

314
00:20:21,400 –> 00:20:23,800
shot each other in the mouth and
caught the bullets.

315
00:20:23,900 –> 00:20:25,600
Yeah.
I think, you know, well, it’s

316
00:20:25,600 –> 00:20:30,200
like it reminds me of a thing.
I did a live show with cracked

317
00:20:30,200 –> 00:20:37,500
once at the LA, the the comic
convention Stanley puts on in

318
00:20:37,500 –> 00:20:40,700
La.
We did well like a live panel

319
00:20:40,800 –> 00:20:44,000
thing.
And we were talking about real

320
00:20:44,000 –> 00:20:47,300
people who had actual super
powers, right?

321
00:20:47,300 –> 00:20:52,200
And the guy I brought up this
isn’t really a superpower but he

322
00:20:52,200 –> 00:20:56,800
could I if you held up Up a
classic record like a classical

323
00:20:56,800 –> 00:21:01,200
music record.
He could tell you what it was

324
00:21:01,600 –> 00:21:05,000
just by looking at the grooves
of the record could tell you

325
00:21:05,000 –> 00:21:10,400
what it was where it was
recorded, when it was recorded

326
00:21:10,500 –> 00:21:13,900
like everything about like
flawlessly.

327
00:21:13,900 –> 00:21:17,800
Yeah, and I think it’s James
Randi is the guy who like

328
00:21:17,900 –> 00:21:19,700
offered people a million
dollars.

329
00:21:19,700 –> 00:21:22,400
Yes.
Love that guy to find love that

330
00:21:22,400 –> 00:21:25,000
they could actually do what they
They did.

331
00:21:25,200 –> 00:21:27,200
Yeah, this guy was able to do
it.

332
00:21:27,200 –> 00:21:31,400
He went on James Randy’s show or
whatever in the thing is, he

333
00:21:31,400 –> 00:21:35,400
eventually was like, well, this
isn’t Magic like right.

334
00:21:35,500 –> 00:21:38,600
I could teach anyone how to do
this, right?

335
00:21:38,600 –> 00:21:43,000
And when he said that people
were just like, I’m out, like I

336
00:21:43,000 –> 00:21:45,400
thought this was going to be
something magical, but you can

337
00:21:45,400 –> 00:21:49,400
tell like, you can tell me how
to do it and like how that is

338
00:21:49,400 –> 00:21:53,600
such an incorrect way to think
about that Centre is something

339
00:21:53,600 –> 00:21:56,200
walks.
In the room and starts flying.

340
00:21:56,200 –> 00:21:58,300
Yeah.
And you’re like, are you magic?

341
00:21:58,300 –> 00:22:00,600
And they’re like, no, I could
show you how to do this in, like

342
00:22:00,600 –> 00:22:05,200
five minutes right here.
Like fuck you stop lying you

343
00:22:05,200 –> 00:22:07,700
fraud, right?
Exactly.

344
00:22:08,100 –> 00:22:12,100
Oh yeah.
So that which is honestly and

345
00:22:12,100 –> 00:22:15,800
you know that is like the thesis
of the entirety of Penn and

346
00:22:15,800 –> 00:22:19,300
tellers live show that’s like
the whole idea is like, you

347
00:22:19,300 –> 00:22:22,400
know, we can tell you literally
step by step, what we’re going

348
00:22:22,400 –> 00:22:25,900
to do and you’re still going to
be Because it’s fucking amazing

349
00:22:26,000 –> 00:22:28,600
and you’re still not going to be
able to do it Rach.

350
00:22:28,600 –> 00:22:32,300
You can’t they even if they tell
you and that actually comes up

351
00:22:32,300 –> 00:22:35,800
in this, this show a bunch where
they’re like, I can’t actually

352
00:22:35,800 –> 00:22:39,300
show you how to do this, right?
And it does and, and they give

353
00:22:39,300 –> 00:22:43,300
will talk about some of the, the
questions that I have at mostly

354
00:22:43,300 –> 00:22:45,800
As It regards to the Sirhan
Sirhan thing.

355
00:22:45,800 –> 00:22:46,600
But right.
Yeah.

356
00:22:46,600 –> 00:22:49,500
And the, the thing about the
Russian Roulette thing, I

357
00:22:49,500 –> 00:22:52,900
haven’t watched the whole
special, but it is suggested

358
00:22:52,900 –> 00:22:56,300
that he’s just using a technique
that was developed in the 70s

359
00:22:56,300 –> 00:22:59,900
called neuro linguistic
programming, right?

360
00:22:59,900 –> 00:23:02,600
And again, he doesn’t claim to
have magic powers.

361
00:23:02,600 –> 00:23:06,800
One thing, I noticed during the
Russian Roulette thing, he tells

362
00:23:06,800 –> 00:23:13,800
the guy to pick a number and
focus on that number and right

363
00:23:13,800 –> 00:23:17,500
after he says it, he goes.
Are you thinking of one now,

364
00:23:17,500 –> 00:23:20,900
right?
And it ends up that the real

365
00:23:20,900 –> 00:23:23,900
bullet was in the chamber
labeled one.

366
00:23:24,300 –> 00:23:27,100
Right.
So he could have just been using

367
00:23:27,200 –> 00:23:30,200
a technique like that where you
just repeatedly suggest the

368
00:23:30,200 –> 00:23:34,800
thing you want the person to do.
But that does start to that kind

369
00:23:34,800 –> 00:23:41,100
of Begins the, I don’t want to
say criticism but like side I

370
00:23:41,100 –> 00:23:44,800
that I kind of have towards
Derren Brown as his career

371
00:23:45,100 –> 00:23:50,100
continues because he uses words
like, you know he throws around

372
00:23:50,200 –> 00:23:54,000
psychological terms that he and
he uses things like nerd, nerd,

373
00:23:54,200 –> 00:23:57,600
Linguistic programming, which is
something that has been

374
00:23:57,600 –> 00:24:02,500
basically, conclusively, shown
to be not a thing, it’s a

375
00:24:02,500 –> 00:24:06,200
pseudoscience, which is fine.
Like, but yeah, but it’s when he

376
00:24:06,200 –> 00:24:11,900
starts to use real psychological
things as misdirection is where

377
00:24:11,900 –> 00:24:15,600
it kind of becomes.
Yeah, not problematic.

378
00:24:15,600 –> 00:24:17,200
That word is so annoying
anymore.

379
00:24:17,200 –> 00:24:18,800
Yeah.
But like, sometimes there’s only

380
00:24:18,800 –> 00:24:22,100
one word to use to describe
something that is has something

381
00:24:22,100 –> 00:24:24,000
resembling a problem.
Yeah.

382
00:24:24,200 –> 00:24:26,500
Yeah.
And that’s where he differs from

383
00:24:26,500 –> 00:24:29,700
David Blaine, David Blaine.
Only involves other people in

384
00:24:29,700 –> 00:24:32,700
the fun shit, right?
Like, he’ll levitate in front of

385
00:24:32,700 –> 00:24:36,700
you but he’s not going to make
me think the apocalypse is about

386
00:24:36,700 –> 00:24:39,200
to happen, right?
Exactly.

387
00:24:39,200 –> 00:24:41,900
That’s probably some shit Criss
Angel would pull if he was a

388
00:24:41,900 –> 00:24:42,800
boy.
I mean, yeah.

389
00:24:42,800 –> 00:24:46,200
Well that would take a real
Mindfreak to do something like

390
00:24:46,200 –> 00:24:50,000
that.
So I did the one Charming Criss

391
00:24:50,000 –> 00:24:53,100
Angel moment I’ve ever seen.
I was watching an episode of his

392
00:24:53,100 –> 00:24:56,600
show and he said, Sitting in the
back of a van and he’s holding a

393
00:24:56,600 –> 00:24:59,600
styrofoam cup and he goes you
want to see a trick right now

394
00:24:59,600 –> 00:25:03,300
and he holds his hand up, and it
looks like the Styrofoam cup is

395
00:25:03,300 –> 00:25:06,500
floating and then he just turns
it over and he had just poke a

396
00:25:06,500 –> 00:25:09,300
hole in the back this foam.
Absolutely.

397
00:25:09,300 –> 00:25:10,600
Okay.
Now that was cute.

398
00:25:10,600 –> 00:25:12,100
Oh yeah.
It’s very but also you fucking

399
00:25:12,100 –> 00:25:13,200
suck.
Yeah.

400
00:25:13,200 –> 00:25:16,100
He’s not very good.
I will say it is a bummer that

401
00:25:16,100 –> 00:25:19,100
Chris Angels took the name
Mindfreak because that would be

402
00:25:19,100 –> 00:25:21,900
a great name for Darren Browns,
specials.

403
00:25:22,200 –> 00:25:23,200
It sure.
Would ya.

404
00:25:24,300 –> 00:25:27,000
Another Derren Brown special to
push this one was

405
00:25:27,000 –> 00:25:30,300
controversially shit.
You should watch this one.

406
00:25:30,300 –> 00:25:33,100
It’s on Netflix.
Yeah, this is one that I haven’t

407
00:25:33,100 –> 00:25:36,400
watched, but I did read, you
know, basically everything there

408
00:25:36,400 –> 00:25:39,900
is to read about it.
He takes people and puts them

409
00:25:39,900 –> 00:25:44,200
through a very specific series
of events, right?

410
00:25:44,200 –> 00:25:48,700
That are meant to kind of
heightened their, I don’t, he

411
00:25:48,700 –> 00:25:50,700
makes he makes people commit
murder.

412
00:25:50,900 –> 00:25:53,700
Like, he makes he gets, I think
it’s four.

413
00:25:54,100 –> 00:25:58,600
People to literally push a man
off the ledge of a building who

414
00:25:58,600 –> 00:26:01,300
is thankfully connected to a
harness, right?

415
00:26:01,300 –> 00:26:04,400
But in there’s one guy who
doesn’t do it right, which they

416
00:26:04,400 –> 00:26:07,900
reveal at the end because at
first, it’s like, everyone did

417
00:26:07,900 –> 00:26:11,200
it like it kind of wrecks.
Your faith in humanity.

418
00:26:11,500 –> 00:26:13,400
Yeah.
But then, there’s one guy who

419
00:26:13,400 –> 00:26:15,000
was, like, fucking call the
police?

420
00:26:15,000 –> 00:26:16,900
I don’t care.
Yeah, I kicked a guy in the

421
00:26:16,900 –> 00:26:20,500
stairwell, I’m not going to
murder somebody, he does have

422
00:26:20,500 –> 00:26:23,400
them kick someone in the
stairwell cranking, they’re

423
00:26:23,400 –> 00:26:27,500
kicking an Will person but a,
and everyone else does it?

424
00:26:27,700 –> 00:26:29,600
Yeah.
And this is where again, the,

425
00:26:29,600 –> 00:26:34,600
the prank show aspect comes in
because this is traumatic, it’s

426
00:26:34,600 –> 00:26:36,600
definitely traumatic.
And I’m not saying that these

427
00:26:36,600 –> 00:26:40,500
people aren’t going through some
shit but they are being through

428
00:26:40,900 –> 00:26:43,500
a great deal of
behind-the-scenes production

429
00:26:43,500 –> 00:26:48,600
value and the use of actors and
sets and all this stuff.

430
00:26:48,600 –> 00:26:53,700
They are putting people into a
position where they feel like

431
00:26:53,700 –> 00:26:59,800
this is all really happening and
pushing it, pushing them to do

432
00:26:59,800 –> 00:27:04,400
what the magician in this case,
Derren Brown once or expects

433
00:27:04,400 –> 00:27:05,800
them to do.
Yeah.

434
00:27:05,800 –> 00:27:09,200
It’s like a more aggressive
version of The Truman Show.

435
00:27:09,200 –> 00:27:11,600
Sure.
We’re like, especially this one

436
00:27:11,600 –> 00:27:17,100
and the apocalypse one, where
your whole entire existence is

437
00:27:17,100 –> 00:27:20,700
being shaped by this television
production, right?

438
00:27:20,700 –> 00:27:23,700
And it’s like, what do you think
people are gonna do, right?

439
00:27:25,100 –> 00:27:29,100
Again Scare Tactics of get I was
thinking about Scare Tactics a

440
00:27:29,100 –> 00:27:32,200
lot, especially while watching
the only one of the Netflix ones

441
00:27:32,200 –> 00:27:37,000
I watched was the sacrifice and
that is just straight up, scare

442
00:27:37,000 –> 00:27:39,900
tactic the apocalypse.
One, there’s literally a scene

443
00:27:39,900 –> 00:27:43,100
where the guy is in a bus
thinking.

444
00:27:43,100 –> 00:27:46,900
He’s going to see The Killers an
undisclosed location.

445
00:27:46,900 –> 00:27:51,300
Like the band, The Killers
rights and needs to be clarified

446
00:27:51,300 –> 00:27:54,000
in this context, meteor start
falling.

447
00:27:54,100 –> 00:27:58,200
From the sky and he’s loading.
That is so scare tactics.

448
00:27:58,400 –> 00:28:01,600
That’s true.
It’s the, I think they tried to

449
00:28:01,608 –> 00:28:04,200
bring it back and it sucked.
But man, at the time I did

450
00:28:04,200 –> 00:28:08,000
enjoy, it’s like the only sketch
show that I really enjoyed that

451
00:28:08,000 –> 00:28:09,800
sketch prank show that I really
interesting.

452
00:28:09,800 –> 00:28:12,900
I generally hate prank shows
there’s an episode of Scare

453
00:28:12,900 –> 00:28:17,600
Tactics where they put a guy in
a car and have him pretend to

454
00:28:17,600 –> 00:28:21,600
start stabbing this, the driver
in the chest.

455
00:28:21,700 –> 00:28:24,000
Yeah.
But they do it with like this.

456
00:28:24,300 –> 00:28:28,500
Ggressive bro, like this
college, dude.

457
00:28:28,500 –> 00:28:33,100
And of course the minute, the
guy starts stabbing, this kid in

458
00:28:33,100 –> 00:28:37,500
the backseat just starts
punching him in the face, so

459
00:28:37,500 –> 00:28:39,300
fucking hard.
It is girlfriend.

460
00:28:39,300 –> 00:28:41,000
Who’s in on the prank starts
going.

461
00:28:41,200 –> 00:28:45,500
Stop.
Stop like imagine how confused.

462
00:28:45,500 –> 00:28:49,500
Yeah, he must have been like he
did, the absolute correct thing

463
00:28:49,900 –> 00:28:51,800
and everyone’s like you
aggressive dick.

464
00:28:52,600 –> 00:28:55,600
Why would you punch that guy?
By the one that I remember the

465
00:28:55,600 –> 00:28:57,500
most.
And I’m sure this will be the

466
00:28:57,500 –> 00:29:01,700
last time we talked about Scare
Tactics, but the one that I

467
00:29:01,700 –> 00:29:05,000
remember most was the people who
were in on it were like,

468
00:29:05,000 –> 00:29:09,400
basically all this guy’s friends
and they all went camping in an

469
00:29:09,400 –> 00:29:12,100
RV.
And then they, you know, the

470
00:29:12,100 –> 00:29:16,900
scare tactics people staged like
a UFO encounter including like a

471
00:29:16,900 –> 00:29:21,700
guy in, you know, a suit and
like lights and like crazy shit.

472
00:29:21,900 –> 00:29:24,000
And I’m like, I wouldn’t
believe.

473
00:29:24,400 –> 00:29:28,400
That, if all of my friends were
there, like I would not but

474
00:29:28,400 –> 00:29:31,600
think that my friends would
betray my trust in such a way.

475
00:29:33,300 –> 00:29:35,400
Yeah.
It’s it’s a lot.

476
00:29:35,400 –> 00:29:37,300
It’s a lot of people through in
the.

477
00:29:37,300 –> 00:29:40,200
I wish I hate sketch show.
I just want sketch.

478
00:29:40,200 –> 00:29:42,000
It keeps a sketch.
I hate prank shows.

479
00:29:42,000 –> 00:29:44,200
I just want to be clear.
I really don’t like I think

480
00:29:44,200 –> 00:29:47,100
they’re a bad idea.
Yeah, Impractical Jokers is

481
00:29:47,100 –> 00:29:49,700
great, but they’re just pranking
each other not.

482
00:29:49,800 –> 00:29:51,600
Well, then everyone else.
That’s a different thing.

483
00:29:51,700 –> 00:29:55,900
The push these people are
Ejected to like three hours of

484
00:29:55,900 –> 00:29:59,400
emotional Terror.
And then they do something

485
00:29:59,400 –> 00:30:04,000
Unthinkable, which sounds crazy
but the police get.

486
00:30:04,000 –> 00:30:06,100
Confessions that way all the
time.

487
00:30:06,400 –> 00:30:11,400
Absolutely, like they will lock
you in a room and emotionally

488
00:30:11,400 –> 00:30:14,400
wreck you to the point where you
confess to a crime.

489
00:30:14,600 –> 00:30:19,100
And Derren Brown has a special
about that to where he basically

490
00:30:19,300 –> 00:30:22,600
guilt someone into believing,
they had something to do with

491
00:30:22,600 –> 00:30:28,300
the death of a celebrity Yeah I
watch that one and that one I

492
00:30:28,300 –> 00:30:34,000
will say seemed very staged I’m
just going to say oh yeah yeah

493
00:30:34,000 –> 00:30:38,700
yeah that one was you know it’s
like a they put this guy in the

494
00:30:38,700 –> 00:30:43,100
big manor house and at night
while he’s asleep it’s implied

495
00:30:43,100 –> 00:30:47,900
that Derren Brown gives him a
subliminal message to keep him

496
00:30:47,900 –> 00:30:53,400
asleep and then they carry him
like they pick him up out of bed

497
00:30:53,400 –> 00:30:57,900
and Carrie.
He him down into the garden, and

498
00:31:05,100 –> 00:31:07,800
I’m just like, I’m sorry, that’s
a little, that’s a little much I

499
00:31:07,800 –> 00:31:10,200
just kicked.
That’s that, I’m sorry.

500
00:31:10,500 –> 00:31:12,000
Yeah, it is.
MM is not real.

501
00:31:12,000 –> 00:31:16,400
And that’s what’s, what’s
interesting about that though is

502
00:31:16,400 –> 00:31:21,300
that the most plausible.
Experiment, is, oh, can you

503
00:31:21,400 –> 00:31:24,000
convince someone that they were
involved in a crime?

504
00:31:24,200 –> 00:31:27,300
They weren’t involved in sure.
Yeah, that’s why Illinois

505
00:31:27,300 –> 00:31:29,200
overturned.
The death penalty.

506
00:31:29,400 –> 00:31:32,400
Yes, it does.
One Cop finally admitted.

507
00:31:32,500 –> 00:31:36,900
He had just coerced confessions
out of hundreds and hundreds of

508
00:31:36,900 –> 00:31:40,100
people and salute, some of them
ended up on death row.

509
00:31:40,100 –> 00:31:43,600
In Illinois was like, fuck.
We’re gonna, we’re gonna execute

510
00:31:43,600 –> 00:31:46,200
a lot of innocent people.
Yeah, if we don’t look into

511
00:31:46,200 –> 00:31:48,500
this, absolutely no way.
Really?

512
00:31:48,500 –> 00:31:51,400
Yeah, that’s a real thing.
Like I’m not yeah, I don’t want

513
00:31:51,400 –> 00:31:54,600
to say that coerced confessions
are Fake.

514
00:31:54,700 –> 00:31:59,500
I’m just saying that particular
coerced confession, seemed fake.

515
00:31:59,500 –> 00:32:04,100
And that’s the one thing.
Like any, he pulls these

516
00:32:04,100 –> 00:32:09,100
participants from like he’ll
send out a tweet and yeah be

517
00:32:09,100 –> 00:32:10,800
like hey, do you want to
participate?

518
00:32:10,800 –> 00:32:13,100
My next thing?
And then he like, doesn’t really

519
00:32:13,100 –> 00:32:16,600
tell people, he just like dust a
bunch of fucking tricks for

520
00:32:16,600 –> 00:32:19,400
them, right and decides who he’s
gonna pick.

521
00:32:19,500 –> 00:32:24,100
But if you’re even responding to
that, yeah, you know, any time.

522
00:32:24,200 –> 00:32:30,200
I’m Darren Brown is in your
presence that might be being

523
00:32:30,200 –> 00:32:31,400
filmed.
Yeah.

524
00:32:31,400 –> 00:32:35,700
Or you know, or if you’re in a
situation that seems maybe

525
00:32:36,000 –> 00:32:41,300
unusual in some way, everything
you do, you have to be

526
00:32:41,300 –> 00:32:43,700
cognizant.
All right, this might be part of

527
00:32:43,700 –> 00:32:46,700
it.
And so then like if you’re in

528
00:32:46,700 –> 00:32:49,400
bed and you’re like, why am I
being picked up?

529
00:32:49,400 –> 00:32:51,500
Oh, there’s dare right?
Exactly.

530
00:32:51,500 –> 00:32:53,900
All right, I’m just gonna roll
with this right?

531
00:32:53,900 –> 00:32:57,300
And And this is this is kind of
this comes to the Crux and we’re

532
00:32:57,900 –> 00:33:00,100
we’re going to talk about Sir
Han later but that’s kind of the

533
00:33:00,100 –> 00:33:04,900
Crux of my of my thing.
About the Assassin is that which

534
00:33:04,900 –> 00:33:07,400
is the episode that we’re going
to be going in depth about is

535
00:33:07,400 –> 00:33:10,100
that it’s just seems like it’s a
lot of people who want to be

536
00:33:10,100 –> 00:33:13,200
there, which is fine.
I mean that’s seems fun and then

537
00:33:13,200 –> 00:33:15,700
the miracle is another Netflix
special.

538
00:33:15,700 –> 00:33:19,600
This one is about sacrifice.
Oh yeah, the sacrifice that that

539
00:33:19,600 –> 00:33:22,400
one is pretty interesting, it
was interesting.

540
00:33:22,400 –> 00:33:25,300
I would love to know more.
Say I would like to know more

541
00:33:25,300 –> 00:33:28,300
about the participant, who I
can’t remember the name know

542
00:33:28,400 –> 00:33:32,500
Phil, I would like to know more
about him in his life.

543
00:33:32,600 –> 00:33:35,600
There’s, that was interesting.
There’s a crazy scene where he

544
00:33:35,600 –> 00:33:39,400
makes Phil just sit down and is
the person who makes him just

545
00:33:39,400 –> 00:33:45,500
sit and stare at Muslim.
I think so I, it was not clear

546
00:33:45,500 –> 00:33:51,100
to me because it’s about Phil,
basically being coerced into

547
00:33:51,100 –> 00:33:54,000
taking a bullet for an illegal
immigrant and fill it.

548
00:33:54,100 –> 00:33:58,500
Is very pro-trump and very
anti-illegal, immigrant it

549
00:33:58,500 –> 00:34:01,500
stated that he’s xenophobic and
I have a much.

550
00:34:01,500 –> 00:34:06,000
I will say, I have a much easier
time thinking like accepting

551
00:34:06,000 –> 00:34:10,800
that the American people that
have been chosen for his

552
00:34:11,199 –> 00:34:13,500
experiments.
Do not know who he is, then the

553
00:34:13,500 –> 00:34:16,900
British right people because he
is so much less famous here than

554
00:34:16,900 –> 00:34:19,100
he is there.
And the difference in the

555
00:34:19,100 –> 00:34:24,000
sacrifice is, it isn’t ending
with someone doing something.

556
00:34:24,199 –> 00:34:27,600
Bad right?
It’s ending with someone doing

557
00:34:27,600 –> 00:34:29,500
the right thing.
Yeah.

558
00:34:29,500 –> 00:34:34,000
Which I’m assuming is a little
easier to coerce out of people.

559
00:34:34,100 –> 00:34:36,900
I would imagine.
I mean, even Hope ya like, I

560
00:34:36,908 –> 00:34:40,500
guess that’s the hope but but
the scene where he sits him down

561
00:34:40,500 –> 00:34:42,699
and just makes him stare at that
guy.

562
00:34:42,900 –> 00:34:46,800
Yeah.
And Phil just starts sobbing in

563
00:34:46,800 –> 00:34:49,699
like trembling.
That’s a heavy scene.

564
00:34:50,100 –> 00:34:54,100
Yeah.
It feels hard to like fill All

565
00:34:54,107 –> 00:34:57,500
is one of our Generations.
Finest actors, right?

566
00:34:57,500 –> 00:35:00,400
He was faking that, it was very
impressive.

567
00:35:00,500 –> 00:35:03,300
There’s some interesting stuff
and I did think it.

568
00:35:03,300 –> 00:35:08,500
Like, I do think it was kind of
fucked up that they cut into his

569
00:35:08,500 –> 00:35:12,000
neck and pierced like, and drew
blood and shit.

570
00:35:12,000 –> 00:35:16,900
And they very much during their
fake implanting of the chip.

571
00:35:16,900 –> 00:35:19,400
That is supposedly causing all
of this Behavior.

572
00:35:19,500 –> 00:35:22,300
I thought, maybe, like, I’m sure
there’s some sort of contract

573
00:35:22,300 –> 00:35:25,900
sign, but it still seemed me A
little unethical.

574
00:35:26,100 –> 00:35:30,100
Oh, so for Project, Runway can
cut people’s necks but not

575
00:35:30,100 –> 00:35:33,500
Derren Brown, you know I’m gonna
go ahead and say that maybe

576
00:35:33,500 –> 00:35:36,900
Project Runway was kind of
success.

577
00:35:36,900 –> 00:35:40,100
You know unethical as well.
I don’t know that they did that

578
00:35:40,100 –> 00:35:42,900
but yeah I know but I mean hey
I’m gonna still going to say the

579
00:35:42,900 –> 00:35:45,900
Project Runway.
I probably I’m not gonna lie I

580
00:35:45,900 –> 00:35:49,200
don’t watch reality TV and at
first I thought that maybe you

581
00:35:49,200 –> 00:35:55,900
were referring to some sort of
secret military And then as I

582
00:35:55,900 –> 00:35:58,300
was speaking, I put it together
that you were talking about the

583
00:35:58,300 –> 00:36:03,000
model show but I do say I want.
Yeah so I think it’s out there.

584
00:36:03,000 –> 00:36:06,200
Great name for a military
project now it would be

585
00:36:06,200 –> 00:36:09,000
impossible to Google information
about it.

586
00:36:09,100 –> 00:36:12,400
I also thought The, you know so
I thought that was fucked up and

587
00:36:12,400 –> 00:36:17,200
I also thought the part where he
they numbed his arm, you know

588
00:36:17,300 –> 00:36:21,400
quote-unquote they used hypnosis
to like make his arm numb was

589
00:36:21,400 –> 00:36:26,700
very funny because they use a
classic Think of what you know,

590
00:36:26,700 –> 00:36:27,500
where they’re like, we’re going
to.

591
00:36:27,500 –> 00:36:30,700
If you think if we put a needle
through your, and you wouldn’t

592
00:36:30,700 –> 00:36:33,300
feel anything and the and feels
like yeah.

593
00:36:33,300 –> 00:36:38,000
No, I mean it’s totally dead.
And so Darren picks up a flap of

594
00:36:38,008 –> 00:36:42,500
his skin and pinches it super
hard it before like for a while

595
00:36:42,500 –> 00:36:46,000
before putting the needle in
which is a classic That’s a

596
00:36:46,000 –> 00:36:48,700
classic wear it.
Because by pinching the skin

597
00:36:48,700 –> 00:36:52,500
like that, you are effectively
killing all of the nerves.

598
00:36:52,500 –> 00:36:56,900
That would feel that sort of Of
pain in the hand and then he oh

599
00:36:56,908 –> 00:36:59,600
he lets it down and he looks at
the Niels like oh wow, it’s

600
00:36:59,600 –> 00:37:02,400
crazy because you can’t really
feel a needle after it’s already

601
00:37:02,400 –> 00:37:03,800
like in there.
Yeah.

602
00:37:03,800 –> 00:37:07,900
So anyway, but yeah, that’s like
all still 70 that oh sure.

603
00:37:07,900 –> 00:37:10,400
Yeah.
It all sells the and again but

604
00:37:10,400 –> 00:37:12,900
like this is the whole thing.
It’s like it’s very weird

605
00:37:12,900 –> 00:37:16,700
because like he’s kind of
stopped being a magician at this

606
00:37:16,700 –> 00:37:19,200
point, right?
Because the only person that he

607
00:37:19,200 –> 00:37:22,600
is playing a magic trick on.
Is this guy?

608
00:37:22,600 –> 00:37:27,300
They, he is convinced that he As
put a mind-control chip inside

609
00:37:27,300 –> 00:37:31,200
of and that is interesting in
one way.

610
00:37:31,200 –> 00:37:34,500
But it is very different than
what you might see, if you went

611
00:37:34,500 –> 00:37:38,800
to a mentalist show, you know,
it’s very different velocity

612
00:37:39,600 –> 00:37:42,400
ship in the guy.
Yeah, it doesn’t really do it,

613
00:37:42,400 –> 00:37:45,600
but right, it’s a good excuse.
I liked it, they show him the

614
00:37:45,600 –> 00:37:47,600
chip.
It’s a nice little prop and

615
00:37:47,600 –> 00:37:47,900
then.
Yeah.

616
00:37:47,900 –> 00:37:51,400
And then the thing at the end,
like, you know, again, very

617
00:37:51,400 –> 00:37:54,500
scared.
Tactics it, I’m not going to say

618
00:37:54,700 –> 00:37:57,800
if I would have known that, it
was staged, but I’m going to

619
00:37:57,800 –> 00:38:01,900
say, I wouldn’t necessarily have
thought everything was super

620
00:38:01,900 –> 00:38:04,100
normal.
That was happening.

621
00:38:04,100 –> 00:38:07,500
It was kind of a weird situation
where he’s in there he’s like

622
00:38:07,500 –> 00:38:12,100
your bar and he’s getting like
inducted into this motorcycle

623
00:38:12,100 –> 00:38:18,000
gang and then they chase out
some, you know, Latino guys.

624
00:38:18,000 –> 00:38:21,100
And then they chase him down in
a truck.

625
00:38:21,100 –> 00:38:24,500
And then there’s a very tense,
Breaking Bad standoff.

626
00:38:24,800 –> 00:38:27,900
In the desert.
And, you know, it’s a lot.

627
00:38:28,000 –> 00:38:30,500
That one that one would not work
in England.

628
00:38:30,700 –> 00:38:33,100
Yeah.
I do like, okay, okay.

629
00:38:33,100 –> 00:38:35,100
I’m getting inducted into our
right.

630
00:38:35,100 –> 00:38:36,900
Yeah, sure, yeah, sure sure,
sure, sure.

631
00:38:36,900 –> 00:38:40,200
I’m totally down and then
there’s one on Netflix called

632
00:38:40,200 –> 00:38:43,700
Miracle, which is about
debunking faith, healers and

633
00:38:43,700 –> 00:38:47,100
religious frauds, and I better
science-loving lives.

634
00:38:47,100 –> 00:38:49,900
Don’t complain about that.
No, I do.

635
00:38:49,900 –> 00:38:52,500
I think it’s all perfectly great
and aboveboard I haven’t seen

636
00:38:52,500 –> 00:38:55,000
it, but I’m sure it’s good.
Well, now it it like, Like

637
00:38:55,400 –> 00:38:59,500
that’s one where he does.
Like he a lot of times he’s like

638
00:38:59,500 –> 00:39:03,000
look these people are just
fucking using plants in the

639
00:39:03,000 –> 00:39:06,700
audience most of the time.
Yeah that’s what like Jim Jones

640
00:39:06,700 –> 00:39:08,500
did that.
Jim Jones pretended to be a

641
00:39:08,500 –> 00:39:10,000
faith healer.
Sure.

642
00:39:10,100 –> 00:39:14,800
And that set even then you still
got to be persuasive enough for

643
00:39:14,800 –> 00:39:19,000
everyone else in the audience to
be like sure shit that seems

644
00:39:19,000 –> 00:39:22,200
real and yeah and that’s why you
know I’m not I’m not going to

645
00:39:22,200 –> 00:39:24,500
ever say that the key is an
untalented.

646
00:39:24,700 –> 00:39:29,700
Ted performer or Illusionist,
he’s obviously gay you know

647
00:39:29,700 –> 00:39:33,700
talented enough to gain this
following that he has even if

648
00:39:33,800 –> 00:39:38,100
like I’m not necessarily a
particular fan of his work I

649
00:39:38,100 –> 00:39:42,800
think that it’s definitely well
done it’s Hit or Miss for sure

650
00:39:43,300 –> 00:39:46,500
like and if you pull up his
YouTube page there are some

651
00:39:46,500 –> 00:39:49,700
crazy fucking videos on there
now.

652
00:39:49,700 –> 00:39:53,000
Yeah, like one is just called
pushing your hand down on a

653
00:39:53,008 –> 00:39:57,400
knife, it’s like Jesus really
scraping the bottom of the

654
00:39:57,400 –> 00:40:07,600
barrel now.
Yeah we’re not talking about any

655
00:40:07,600 –> 00:40:09,700
of those specials today.
Even though we’ve been talking

656
00:40:09,700 –> 00:40:14,900
for about them for about 40
minutes we’re talking about an

657
00:40:14,900 –> 00:40:20,800
episode of a series from 2011
called the experiments and the

658
00:40:20,800 –> 00:40:27,300
episode is called the Assassin
and it covers A theory from the

659
00:40:27,300 –> 00:40:31,800
RFK assassination which is the
girl in the polkadot dress

660
00:40:32,000 –> 00:40:34,700
Theory.
Olivia, did you watch the a any

661
00:40:34,700 –> 00:40:37,600
documentary about the
assassination of Bobby?

662
00:40:37,600 –> 00:40:39,600
Kennedy, I did.
Yes.

663
00:40:39,800 –> 00:40:42,600
What did you think?
I thought was interesting.

664
00:40:42,600 –> 00:40:46,700
You know, it’s a it’s a
fascinating topic and they had a

665
00:40:46,700 –> 00:40:50,100
lot of really interesting
archive audio and that sort of

666
00:40:50,100 –> 00:40:54,200
thing that I really enjoyed the
interrogation.

667
00:40:54,600 –> 00:40:59,200
Of I’m going to Blink on her
name.

668
00:40:59,200 –> 00:41:01,600
Sounds baby.
So Sandy Serrano.

669
00:41:01,900 –> 00:41:03,800
I thought that was a really
interesting.

670
00:41:03,800 –> 00:41:09,100
Just as a evidence just like as
police corruption evidence.

671
00:41:09,200 –> 00:41:13,700
I found very fascinating because
that is it’s horrific what that

672
00:41:14,100 –> 00:41:17,800
tape reveals.
Yeah, he’s basically Sandy

673
00:41:17,800 –> 00:41:22,400
Serrano is one of the reasons
the girl in the polkadot dress

674
00:41:22,400 –> 00:41:28,300
Theory exists, right?
The ideas that Sirhan Sirhan was

675
00:41:28,400 –> 00:41:31,900
under hypnosis has some sort.
It’s been floating around pretty

676
00:41:31,900 –> 00:41:35,700
much from the minute, he was
apprehended and there’s a quote

677
00:41:35,700 –> 00:41:40,000
from an LAPD officer which I’m
kind of I’m repeating stuff from

678
00:41:40,000 –> 00:41:42,400
our actual RFK episode.
Yeah.

679
00:41:42,400 –> 00:41:46,800
But just this bit that episode
is those it’s a whole thing.

680
00:41:47,700 –> 00:41:51,100
But this is a quote, from LAPD
officer Randolph, a dare.

681
00:41:51,200 –> 00:41:54,500
The guy was real confused.
It was like, it didn’t exactly.

682
00:41:54,600 –> 00:41:59,400
He hit him what he had done, he
had a black glass over look on

683
00:41:59,400 –> 00:42:01,900
his face.
Like he wasn’t in complete

684
00:42:01,900 –> 00:42:06,900
control of his mind at the time
and hypnosis like they, it

685
00:42:06,900 –> 00:42:11,100
seemed like everyone was using
it on Sirhan Sirhan, because he

686
00:42:11,100 –> 00:42:13,800
was hypnotized during
interrogation.

687
00:42:14,100 –> 00:42:18,200
He alleges, he was hypnotized by
the people who set him up to

688
00:42:18,200 –> 00:42:23,700
commit this murder, right?
But the gist is he’s he says he

689
00:42:23,700 –> 00:42:26,100
doesn’t remember.
Like this, right?

690
00:42:26,200 –> 00:42:29,300
Which is pretty integral to the
Derren Brown Episode.

691
00:42:29,700 –> 00:42:32,300
It is that we’re going to talk
about.

692
00:42:32,400 –> 00:42:36,700
He did say one time while he was
under hypnosis that he

693
00:42:36,700 –> 00:42:39,300
remembered meeting a girl in a
polka dot dress.

694
00:42:39,400 –> 00:42:41,500
This is a quote.
I’m trying to figure out how to

695
00:42:41,500 –> 00:42:43,700
hit on her.
That’s all that I can think

696
00:42:43,700 –> 00:42:45,500
about.
I was fascinated with her.

697
00:42:45,500 –> 00:42:50,600
Looks she never said much, it
was very erotic, I was consumed

698
00:42:50,600 –> 00:42:53,100
by her.
She was a seductress with an

699
00:42:53,300 –> 00:42:59,500
unspoken Ian availability and
there is one picture of a girl

700
00:42:59,500 –> 00:43:03,000
in a polka dot dress.
Right from that night.

701
00:43:03,000 –> 00:43:07,500
You only see her from the back.
She does look like a seductress.

702
00:43:07,800 –> 00:43:10,000
Sure.
I mean as far as you can tell

703
00:43:10,000 –> 00:43:14,900
that from a woman’s back in her
hair, she’s got great hair to

704
00:43:14,900 –> 00:43:15,700
you’re right.
She does.

705
00:43:15,700 –> 00:43:16,900
Oh, it’s a great, it’s great
hair.

706
00:43:16,900 –> 00:43:18,300
It is.
Yeah, it’s amazing.

707
00:43:18,300 –> 00:43:22,000
So Sandy Serrano she was a
Kennedy campaign volunteer.

708
00:43:22,100 –> 00:43:24,400
She told NBC news, reporter
named sander.

709
00:43:24,600 –> 00:43:30,400
Van Acker, great name.
Wow, on live TV about seeing a

710
00:43:30,400 –> 00:43:34,700
young woman in a polka dot dress
and a male companion, who passed

711
00:43:34,700 –> 00:43:38,100
her on a fire escape the woman
in the polkadot dress said, we

712
00:43:38,100 –> 00:43:41,200
shot him.
We shot him once around no asked

713
00:43:41,200 –> 00:43:44,300
who they shot.
The woman said, Senator Kennedy

714
00:43:44,400 –> 00:43:48,800
and ran off another witness in
the pantry Vincent de P.

715
00:43:48,800 –> 00:43:53,200
Rio told the LAPD about a woman
in a white dress with dark polka

716
00:43:53,200 –> 00:43:58,300
dots who Seem to be holding sir
Han just before the shooting.

717
00:43:58,300 –> 00:44:02,000
According to Sirhan Sirhan, this
woman, pinched him on the

718
00:44:02,000 –> 00:44:05,600
shoulder.
Spun him around to show him,

719
00:44:05,600 –> 00:44:07,700
people coming in, through the
pantry.

720
00:44:07,700 –> 00:44:12,500
And this is a quote, then I was
on the target range of flashback

721
00:44:12,700 –> 00:44:15,800
to the shooting range.
I didn’t know that I had a gun.

722
00:44:16,800 –> 00:44:22,300
Pretty weird.
Yeah, I will say that if someone

723
00:44:22,300 –> 00:44:25,900
overheard me, Naming.
We shot him.

724
00:44:25,900 –> 00:44:29,200
We shot him.
And they asked, what, who, what

725
00:44:29,200 –> 00:44:33,500
I meant, I would probably not
respond with the name of the

726
00:44:33,500 –> 00:44:37,100
person that I shot.
Just, that’s just me, that’s

727
00:44:37,100 –> 00:44:39,600
just me.
So you think Sandy Serrano was

728
00:44:39,600 –> 00:44:41,900
lying?
No, I don’t think Sadie’s Rana

729
00:44:41,900 –> 00:44:45,300
was necessarily lying.
I just think that that is an odd

730
00:44:45,300 –> 00:44:47,500
thing to do.
If you’ve just killed someone.

731
00:44:48,000 –> 00:44:52,400
Yeah, it’s definitely an odd
thing to do.

732
00:44:52,600 –> 00:44:57,000
But the person who Says it
happened is very convincing.

733
00:44:57,200 –> 00:45:03,000
Because as you mentioned, there
is audio of the police trying to

734
00:45:03,000 –> 00:45:05,800
get Sandy Serrano to change her
story.

735
00:45:06,000 –> 00:45:09,100
Yeah.
So either Sandy Serrano and

736
00:45:09,100 –> 00:45:14,100
fucking Sirhan Sirhan were
working together or she is just

737
00:45:14,100 –> 00:45:17,200
a fantastic.
Liar, who’s lying for no reason.

738
00:45:17,400 –> 00:45:19,000
Right?
Like I don’t want to say that

739
00:45:19,000 –> 00:45:21,200
I’m not gonna accuse any Serano
of lying.

740
00:45:21,200 –> 00:45:23,500
I’m not saying that all.
I just think that’s a, I just

741
00:45:23,500 –> 00:45:24,400
think that’s a weird thing to
say.

742
00:45:24,600 –> 00:45:29,400
A, that’s it, that’s all I mean.
Yeah, it definitely is.

743
00:45:29,500 –> 00:45:32,300
I would, I’m just saying if I
were in that situation and I had

744
00:45:32,300 –> 00:45:36,200
just orchestrated the murder of
a famous Senator, we’re probably

745
00:45:36,200 –> 00:45:38,700
not talk to anyone about it.
I would keep that to myself.

746
00:45:38,700 –> 00:45:43,800
Here is one possibility, though,
it’s a heat-of-the-moment thing,

747
00:45:43,800 –> 00:45:46,400
right?
This Woman’s running toward her

748
00:45:46,400 –> 00:45:48,200
shouting.
It’s possible.

749
00:45:48,200 –> 00:45:52,700
She might have heard we shot him
but she was actually saying they

750
00:45:52,700 –> 00:45:55,000
shot him or shot him.
Yeah.

751
00:45:55,000 –> 00:45:57,600
Like, especially if she was
saying he shot him right, right?

752
00:45:57,600 –> 00:45:59,000
Right.
He shot him.

753
00:45:59,000 –> 00:46:03,800
Or or we shot them and maybe she
just, you know, assume Senator

754
00:46:03,800 –> 00:46:04,900
Kennedy.
I don’t know.

755
00:46:04,900 –> 00:46:07,100
Again, I don’t want to talk.
I definitely don’t want to

756
00:46:07,100 –> 00:46:11,500
accuse saying Serano lying.
Yes that’s do because the police

757
00:46:11,500 –> 00:46:13,800
have already tried their best,
it’s obvious that that won’t

758
00:46:13,800 –> 00:46:16,000
work.
So, you know.

759
00:46:16,200 –> 00:46:17,200
Yeah.
Yeah.

760
00:46:17,200 –> 00:46:21,200
And the stuff that the physical
evidence that they bring up in

761
00:46:21,200 –> 00:46:24,300
that documentary is the most
compelling to me.

762
00:46:24,500 –> 00:46:28,600
Has Sirhan Sirhan, never got
close enough to fire the shots

763
00:46:28,600 –> 00:46:30,800
that killed Bobby Kennedy.
Right.

764
00:46:30,800 –> 00:46:34,000
And this is the thing that this
is, the very interesting thing

765
00:46:34,100 –> 00:46:38,600
about the mind control the whole
Robert.

766
00:46:38,600 –> 00:46:41,700
I mean, obviously you’ve done an
episode about Bobby Kennedy.

767
00:46:42,000 –> 00:46:45,000
We don’t need to rehash the
whole thing, but like, there are

768
00:46:45,000 –> 00:46:49,300
a couple conflicting.
I would say, conspiracy theories

769
00:46:49,300 –> 00:46:51,500
about what happened to Robert
Kennedy.

770
00:46:51,700 –> 00:46:54,300
And I’m not saying any of them
are necessarily true or false.

771
00:46:54,500 –> 00:46:58,200
But like, it doesn’t make a lot
of sense for there to, for

772
00:46:58,200 –> 00:47:02,000
Sirhan Sirhan to have been
mind-controlled into shooting

773
00:47:02,000 –> 00:47:05,400
Kennedy and then someone else
did it because the angle of the

774
00:47:05,400 –> 00:47:07,600
bullet comes from.
I don’t know if there’s just a

775
00:47:07,607 –> 00:47:11,800
lot of conflicting evidence,
like everyone.

776
00:47:11,800 –> 00:47:16,100
So everyone saw him pointing a
gun at Kennedy, but also all the

777
00:47:16,100 –> 00:47:20,000
evidence points to the gunshot
coming from behind, so I don’t

778
00:47:20,000 –> 00:47:22,600
know.
It’s a lot of evidence was

779
00:47:22,600 –> 00:47:26,500
destroyed, like all of it.
There is a photographer who was

780
00:47:26,500 –> 00:47:29,700
in the room who they interview
in the A&E documentary, who was

781
00:47:29,700 –> 00:47:32,400
behind Kennedy, when the
shooting happened.

782
00:47:32,600 –> 00:47:37,600
And he took a bunch of pictures
turned him over to the LAPD LAPD

783
00:47:37,600 –> 00:47:40,000
was like we destroyed them bub.
Sorry.

784
00:47:40,100 –> 00:47:41,100
No.
Absolutely.

785
00:47:41,100 –> 00:47:45,800
And but yeah, my basic idea
point would be that if there was

786
00:47:45,800 –> 00:47:50,900
a group who wanted to murder RFK
and Lord knows that there were

787
00:47:50,900 –> 00:47:53,100
groups that wanted to murder
RFK.

788
00:47:53,500 –> 00:47:57,400
A lot like Like if they were
going to shoot him from behind

789
00:47:57,400 –> 00:48:01,000
and you know, they were ready to
do that, they wouldn’t need to

790
00:48:01,200 –> 00:48:05,700
program Sirhan Sirhan to do
anything because he unless, you

791
00:48:05,700 –> 00:48:08,100
know, their programming him to
look like a patsy, which is like

792
00:48:08,100 –> 00:48:12,800
a different thing.
But it’s also possible that

793
00:48:12,900 –> 00:48:17,500
Sirhan Sirhan and the guy who
shot Bobby, Kennedy, did not

794
00:48:17,600 –> 00:48:21,700
know about each other, right?
Which is that case they might

795
00:48:21,700 –> 00:48:25,500
have been banking on Sirhan
Sirhan to shoot the I who shot

796
00:48:25,500 –> 00:48:29,400
Bobby Kennedy because yeah, they
would have been basically their

797
00:48:29,400 –> 00:48:31,900
heads would have been side by
side, right?

798
00:48:31,900 –> 00:48:34,700
If you look into how that guy
was walking Kennedy through

799
00:48:34,700 –> 00:48:36,600
there.
So they might have just fucked

800
00:48:36,600 –> 00:48:37,600
up.
Yeah.

801
00:48:37,800 –> 00:48:41,200
Or again like this is another
this this is come up when we

802
00:48:41,200 –> 00:48:46,200
talk about JFK but I like the
theory that a bodyguard yeah,

803
00:48:46,200 –> 00:48:49,900
killed JFK on accident, maybe it
was the same thing that happened

804
00:48:49,900 –> 00:48:51,900
with RFK.
It’s just a crazy coincidence

805
00:48:51,900 –> 00:48:54,500
and then they decided like, you
know, like Sirhan Sirhan.

806
00:48:54,600 –> 00:48:56,900
And came up with a gun pointed
at Kennedy.

807
00:48:57,000 –> 00:49:00,100
Bodyguard gets his gun out.
Somebody moves something

808
00:49:00,100 –> 00:49:02,600
happens.
And you know, like, I don’t

809
00:49:02,600 –> 00:49:04,600
know.
Yeah, that’s, that’s one of the

810
00:49:05,100 –> 00:49:08,300
most compelling bits of
conflicting.

811
00:49:08,300 –> 00:49:13,800
Evidence is the LAPD claimed
there were like eight shots,

812
00:49:14,000 –> 00:49:17,500
right?
And the FBI said there were 11

813
00:49:17,700 –> 00:49:21,100
bullets.
I believe in the room, he Sirhan

814
00:49:21,100 –> 00:49:23,600
sirhan’s gun.
Only held eight bullets, right?

815
00:49:23,600 –> 00:49:26,600
And the LAPD, Tried to get the
FBI to retract.

816
00:49:26,600 –> 00:49:30,700
That the FBI was like we know
what a fucking bullet in a wall.

817
00:49:30,700 –> 00:49:35,600
Looks like and you know, I don’t
want to say anything slanderous

818
00:49:35,600 –> 00:49:40,800
about the LAPD please don’t.
I mean but I you know, it

819
00:49:40,800 –> 00:49:43,600
wouldn’t be beyond the realm of
possibility to me that.

820
00:49:43,600 –> 00:49:48,300
Maybe they fucked up.
Wow, and killed RFK.

821
00:49:48,500 –> 00:49:50,400
Wow, you went there?
I did.

822
00:49:50,400 –> 00:49:54,400
I’m sorry, geez I know I’m still
just get this podcast taken off

823
00:49:54,400 –> 00:49:58,300
the Are we should just move on
all this lab here in these

824
00:49:58,300 –> 00:50:03,200
voices in my ears again, perfect
makes sense.

825
00:50:04,100 –> 00:50:06,100
So let’s talk about this
episode.

826
00:50:06,100 –> 00:50:10,400
Yes, it is basically Derren
Brown trying to recreate what

827
00:50:10,400 –> 00:50:13,700
Sirhan Sirhan says happened to
him, right?

828
00:50:13,800 –> 00:50:16,600
And it starts with Derren Brown
doing a bunch of hypnotism

829
00:50:16,600 –> 00:50:20,600
tricks in front of a live
audience right off the bat.

830
00:50:20,600 –> 00:50:23,000
I’d like to reassure anyone who
watches this.

831
00:50:23,000 –> 00:50:25,600
Yes.
The 52.

832
00:50:25,800 –> 00:50:29,400
Hypnotism act?
Yes, is indeed real thing.

833
00:50:29,500 –> 00:50:32,600
I look that up as well.
I read the ACT.

834
00:50:32,600 –> 00:50:36,900
Yeah like to it I read it.
British law is extremely weird

835
00:50:36,900 –> 00:50:40,900
and hard to read especially from
the 50s but I did read it.

836
00:50:41,000 –> 00:50:45,400
They go hard laying out the
rules for what a hypnotist Canon

837
00:50:45,400 –> 00:50:47,800
camera either.
You can tell that in the 50s of

838
00:50:47,800 –> 00:50:52,700
people in Parliament were like
super freaked out by Svengoolie

839
00:50:52,700 –> 00:50:56,400
or something like Yeah.
I’m Enos is MKUltra, is in full

840
00:50:56,400 –> 00:50:57,900
swing by this point?
Yeah.

841
00:50:57,900 –> 00:51:01,100
That’s like you.
The Americans are doing Jesus.

842
00:51:01,100 –> 00:51:03,000
Lord.
It’s some sort or maybe like

843
00:51:03,000 –> 00:51:06,300
some sort of Cold War thing.
Well, what if the, what if the

844
00:51:06,300 –> 00:51:09,500
Russians put like hypnotists on
TV or yeah?

845
00:51:09,500 –> 00:51:11,100
I don’t know.
It’s very funny.

846
00:51:13,200 –> 00:51:15,500
I think they’re like, if this
works we don’t want it to

847
00:51:15,508 –> 00:51:21,700
fucking work on everybody almost
every dumb law that was made

848
00:51:21,700 –> 00:51:24,500
between the end of World War
Two.

849
00:51:24,600 –> 00:51:29,000
In the 90s in Britain or America
or wherever could be traced to

850
00:51:29,000 –> 00:51:29,800
Red.
Scare.

851
00:51:29,800 –> 00:51:34,700
Basically, it’s all communism.
So the point of this part is

852
00:51:34,700 –> 00:51:38,900
he’s trying to find the person
who’s most compliant enough to

853
00:51:38,900 –> 00:51:41,900
play programmed to kill someone
and I like that.

854
00:51:41,900 –> 00:51:44,200
He’s up front.
I mean, at least kind of

855
00:51:44,200 –> 00:51:47,500
upfront, he doesn’t show you
right obviously.

856
00:51:47,500 –> 00:51:50,200
But that would make for boring
television, but he’s up front

857
00:51:50,200 –> 00:51:54,300
about the fact that not everyone
Falls for this shit.

858
00:51:54,600 –> 00:51:58,300
Right.
But that is kind of to me that’s

859
00:51:58,300 –> 00:52:02,900
part of his his trick.
That’s you know at this point it

860
00:52:02,900 –> 00:52:05,800
feels more like Derren Brown is
play.

861
00:52:05,900 –> 00:52:09,900
He’s playing tricks on the
audience at home more than he’s

862
00:52:09,900 –> 00:52:13,400
playing any tricks on anybody
that he’s actually interacting

863
00:52:13,400 –> 00:52:19,400
with like he’s, you know, he is
very consciously like explaining

864
00:52:19,700 –> 00:52:24,400
the supposed psychological
principles that he is.

865
00:52:24,600 –> 00:52:29,700
Using to conduct these you know
experiments that he as he calls

866
00:52:29,700 –> 00:52:33,400
them or whatever.
But like he basically he says

867
00:52:33,400 –> 00:52:39,300
that he liked performs illusions
that look like tricks because

868
00:52:39,300 –> 00:52:44,900
he’s using psychology but really
it’s more like he’s performing

869
00:52:44,900 –> 00:52:51,200
illusions that look like
Psychology by using like tricks

870
00:52:51,400 –> 00:52:56,000
like magician tricks I I agree
with If that in regards to one

871
00:52:56,000 –> 00:53:00,100
of the experiments he does in
this part, which is the acid

872
00:53:00,100 –> 00:53:02,100
experiment.
Yeah, that’s the one where it’s

873
00:53:02,100 –> 00:53:04,900
the most obvious.
Definitely a no one.

874
00:53:04,900 –> 00:53:10,800
I feel like no one’s going to go
on a Derren Brown TV show,

875
00:53:11,000 –> 00:53:12,600
right?
And expect that.

876
00:53:12,600 –> 00:53:16,600
He’s really gonna give you acid
to throw in someone’s face.

877
00:53:16,700 –> 00:53:20,300
I mean I’ll go one step further.
I don’t think anyone’s going to

878
00:53:20,300 –> 00:53:25,800
go on any TV show as an audience
member In think that if they’re

879
00:53:25,800 –> 00:53:28,700
put in that situation, they are
going to on camera.

880
00:53:28,700 –> 00:53:32,200
They are going to be given real
acid to throw in someone’s face.

881
00:53:32,500 –> 00:53:36,600
And if you do, you are filming a
show in North Korea, probably

882
00:53:37,000 –> 00:53:41,000
because that is how Kim Jang
Hoon, killed his brother, right?

883
00:53:41,000 –> 00:53:43,200
Yeah, it was.
And that was how he did it was

884
00:53:43,400 –> 00:53:45,900
by getting a bunch of people
onto a game show.

885
00:53:45,900 –> 00:53:48,000
And he did.
Well, he did.

886
00:53:48,000 –> 00:53:51,200
He have you, have you seen the
documentary assassins?

887
00:53:51,500 –> 00:53:54,400
I have not.
No, it is about how.

888
00:53:54,500 –> 00:53:58,500
Ow two girls were tricked into
killing Kim jong-un’s brother.

889
00:53:59,100 –> 00:54:02,300
And the way North Korea did it
is they convince these girls

890
00:54:02,300 –> 00:54:05,800
they were on a prank show.
Yeah, and four months before

891
00:54:05,800 –> 00:54:09,200
this they had them pulling these
pranks where they would run up

892
00:54:09,200 –> 00:54:11,200
and rub lotion on someone’s
face.

893
00:54:11,200 –> 00:54:14,200
I have heard of this in the
airport and then they would run

894
00:54:14,200 –> 00:54:19,000
away in the last time they did
that prank it was VX nerve agent

895
00:54:19,200 –> 00:54:22,400
on their hands and they killed
Kim jong-un’s brother.

896
00:54:22,700 –> 00:54:25,400
And then everyone they were
working with Disappeared.

897
00:54:25,400 –> 00:54:29,300
Wow, and it’s an interesting
documentary, North Korea fucked

898
00:54:29,300 –> 00:54:35,300
up in a really big way in that,
they basically set up two girls

899
00:54:35,300 –> 00:54:39,600
who relentlessly documented
everything they did online.

900
00:54:40,200 –> 00:54:43,500
So they were like, yeah, here’s
pictures of the people who set

901
00:54:43,500 –> 00:54:47,600
us up and so it didn’t
completely work, but it did work

902
00:54:47,600 –> 00:54:51,400
in that they killed.
Kim jong-un’s brother on a prank

903
00:54:51,400 –> 00:54:53,900
show, right?
But other than that.

904
00:54:53,900 –> 00:54:55,800
Yeah.
No TV shows going to let you

905
00:54:55,800 –> 00:54:58,100
throw acid in.
Someone’s face second, they went

906
00:54:58,100 –> 00:55:02,700
to a friggin channel for Studio.
I doubt, they’re expecting that

907
00:55:02,700 –> 00:55:06,400
they’re going to kill someone.
I did find the ice experiments

908
00:55:06,500 –> 00:55:11,100
interesting because that to me
speaks to a phenomenon.

909
00:55:11,100 –> 00:55:15,000
We know happens, which is people
undergoing surgery.

910
00:55:15,000 –> 00:55:19,000
Without anesthesia just through
hypnotism, I’ll link to an

911
00:55:19,000 –> 00:55:22,400
article from The Washington Post
from 1990.

912
00:55:22,400 –> 00:55:24,400
And there’s a doctor quoted in
there.

913
00:55:24,700 –> 00:55:27,500
Who is like this will not work
for everybody.

914
00:55:27,500 –> 00:55:31,900
You have to be very strong
mentally if you have Alzheimers,

915
00:55:31,900 –> 00:55:35,600
if you’re an addict, if you’re
depressed, if you’re just

916
00:55:35,600 –> 00:55:38,900
naturally skeptical, this will
not work.

917
00:55:39,000 –> 00:55:44,600
So they really intensely screen.
Their patients who want to try

918
00:55:44,600 –> 00:55:45,900
this?
For some reason?

919
00:55:46,200 –> 00:55:49,000
If I guess you’re just scared
of, I mean, general anesthesia

920
00:55:49,000 –> 00:55:51,000
can get kills people all the
time.

921
00:55:51,200 –> 00:55:52,100
I’m sure.
Yeah.

922
00:55:52,200 –> 00:55:54,300
So that’s kind of what Darren
Browns.

923
00:55:54,500 –> 00:55:56,100
Doing here.
Yeah.

924
00:55:56,100 –> 00:55:59,500
And this is I would say the
thing in the program that is the

925
00:55:59,500 –> 00:56:04,300
closest to what you would call
like real quote, unquote

926
00:56:04,300 –> 00:56:11,000
hypnosis like yeah, I have
doubts that the water is quite

927
00:56:11,000 –> 00:56:14,500
as cold as maybe they say it is.
It’s obviously very cold.

928
00:56:14,500 –> 00:56:18,000
They have a thermal imager.
I’ve read, I in doing my

929
00:56:18,000 –> 00:56:20,900
research, I did read reports
from people who are in both of

930
00:56:20,900 –> 00:56:24,400
the audience’s that were on this
episode.

931
00:56:25,000 –> 00:56:29,500
And you know, as far as you can
trust anything that anyone says

932
00:56:29,600 –> 00:56:33,300
on the internet, it does seem
like the thermal imaging camera

933
00:56:33,300 –> 00:56:36,600
that they use to, like, show how
cold people are real.

934
00:56:36,900 –> 00:56:40,000
Yeah, but, you know, again like
it Community.

935
00:56:40,100 –> 00:56:42,900
It’s how you find ghosts.
Olivia, of course rights.

936
00:56:42,900 –> 00:56:45,800
We will, of course exactly.
And that’s obviously true as

937
00:56:45,800 –> 00:56:47,800
well.
But yeah, you know, like there

938
00:56:47,800 –> 00:56:52,400
are ways to mentally numb
yourself or, you know, like make

939
00:56:52,400 –> 00:56:54,200
your pain threshold higher than
it might.

940
00:56:54,200 –> 00:56:56,200
Otherwise, A wise be, we talked
about it.

941
00:56:56,500 –> 00:56:59,400
The sacrifice, you know, where
the guy thinks his arm is numb.

942
00:56:59,500 –> 00:57:01,500
Yeah.
David Blaine like he.

943
00:57:01,500 –> 00:57:04,300
Yeah, he was inside a block of
ice for a few days.

944
00:57:04,400 –> 00:57:06,300
Sure.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

945
00:57:06,700 –> 00:57:10,200
I thought this was interesting
again, like, very basic like

946
00:57:10,200 –> 00:57:22,600
Mentalist type stuff.
Hey folks, this is Anna.

947
00:57:22,600 –> 00:57:25,700
Valenzuela deviates from the
twelve questions podcast.

948
00:57:26,300 –> 00:57:29,000
We host a show about all types
of people recovering from life’s

949
00:57:29,000 –> 00:57:31,700
curveballs.
We asked unique and fun guests,

950
00:57:31,700 –> 00:57:34,800
12 questions, to give listeners
hope and inspiration.

951
00:57:35,600 –> 00:57:38,400
Whether you’ve got addiction
problems anger problems or just

952
00:57:38,400 –> 00:57:40,800
plain old getting through the
days that feel the same We

953
00:57:40,800 –> 00:57:43,400
Believe recovery isn’t just for
clean and sober people.

954
00:57:43,900 –> 00:57:46,300
So if you’re looking for a pick
me up at the beginning of the

955
00:57:46,600 –> 00:57:50,400
Tune in to our Show new episodes
released every Monday available

956
00:57:50,400 –> 00:57:53,300
wherever you get your podcast
and if you’re out there and

957
00:57:53,300 –> 00:57:55,700
you’re feeling lost, we’ve been
there and we just want to let

958
00:57:55,700 –> 00:58:09,700
you know, we love you.
So he finally settles on a young

959
00:58:09,700 –> 00:58:15,000
Val, Kilmer, and I saw this in
the notes, I don’t get it.

960
00:58:15,100 –> 00:58:18,800
I’m not gonna say I’ve seen
young Val, Kilmer, he’s hot.

961
00:58:18,900 –> 00:58:21,800
There’s a scene at the end where
I mean, I’m not saying the

962
00:58:21,800 –> 00:58:26,100
completely like young Val Kilmer
like a young Val Kilmer.

963
00:58:26,100 –> 00:58:29,300
If he never became an actor,
sure, something like that.

964
00:58:29,500 –> 00:58:33,600
A teen Val Kilmer, I guess, I
mean, this guy was definitely an

965
00:58:34,100 –> 00:58:37,900
Alt what I couldn’t even tell he
acted like a child.

966
00:58:38,100 –> 00:58:42,600
Well, you know, he’s being put
through a series of kind of

967
00:58:42,600 –> 00:58:44,500
childish activities.
So yeah.

968
00:58:44,500 –> 00:58:49,600
I mean, he was, he was the lucky
crowd member who was deemed most

969
00:58:49,600 –> 00:58:52,800
likely to be able to be
programmed to assassinate.

970
00:58:52,800 –> 00:58:57,300
Beloved British actor, Steven
basically he was picked.

971
00:58:57,300 –> 00:59:01,800
As this guy, is the biggest
Aaron Brown fan in the audience,

972
00:59:01,800 –> 00:59:03,900
you win?
Congratulations.

973
00:59:04,800 –> 00:59:09,000
So the the first thing they put
this kid through is Marksman

974
00:59:09,000 –> 00:59:12,300
mode training which is one of
the things.

975
00:59:12,500 –> 00:59:15,800
When Sirhan Sirhan, says,
everything looked like a gun

976
00:59:15,800 –> 00:59:18,200
range.
That’s what they’re trying to

977
00:59:18,200 –> 00:59:20,800
implant in this kid in this
part.

978
00:59:20,900 –> 00:59:26,100
And again, this is using a
pretty I guess.

979
00:59:26,100 –> 00:59:31,000
Just an accelerated version of a
thing that athletes do a lot

980
00:59:31,000 –> 00:59:33,300
which is visualization.
Sure.

981
00:59:33,300 –> 00:59:35,900
Sure sure.
I understand that visualization

982
00:59:35,900 –> 00:59:38,600
though.
Takes a very long time, right?

983
00:59:38,600 –> 00:59:43,300
Well, that’s Darren Brown’s
whole thing is that he does an

984
00:59:43,300 –> 00:59:47,700
accelerated version of that and
I don’t completely doubt that.

985
00:59:47,700 –> 00:59:52,600
That’s possible.
I I don’t necessarily doubt that

986
00:59:52,600 –> 00:59:56,700
that’s possible.
I do doubt that, that is, what

987
00:59:56,700 –> 01:00:00,700
is happening in this program
that feel this feels to me,

988
01:00:00,700 –> 01:00:04,700
like, a classic.
Like I was saying, That’s his

989
01:00:04,700 –> 01:00:08,500
sleight of hand is explaining to
you what he’s doing and then

990
01:00:08,500 –> 01:00:11,600
doing something a little
trickier because again, this

991
01:00:11,600 –> 01:00:15,200
none of this is this live.
This is all pre-recorded and

992
01:00:15,200 –> 01:00:16,200
edited.
Yeah.

993
01:00:17,200 –> 01:00:21,200
And, you know, he does become a,
you know, they show him becoming

994
01:00:21,200 –> 01:00:25,400
a good shooter but we never we
don’t have any proof that that

995
01:00:25,400 –> 01:00:29,200
is actually what happened, you
know, like an idea be that part.

996
01:00:29,200 –> 01:00:32,300
I don’t mean like and I know
that that could be like a, you

997
01:00:32,308 –> 01:00:33,900
know, I don’t want to be a total
disaster.

998
01:00:34,000 –> 01:00:37,700
Denial list or whatever.
But you know, at a certain point

999
01:00:37,700 –> 01:00:40,100
I have to be like, there’s no
way that the guy can go from

1000
01:00:40,100 –> 01:00:43,900
being shitty at with a gun and
not using it at all to being a

1001
01:00:43,900 –> 01:00:46,900
great Marksman in that span of a
time.

1002
01:00:47,300 –> 01:00:51,500
Even with conditioning, have you
ever gone to a shooting range?

1003
01:00:51,600 –> 01:00:53,000
Yes, I’ve shot.
I fired a gun.

1004
01:00:53,000 –> 01:00:54,600
I’ve gone hunting.
I grew up in the country.

1005
01:00:54,600 –> 01:00:58,400
Yeah, I mean, I feel like that’s
been my experience.

1006
01:00:58,400 –> 01:01:02,800
Like, the one time I went to a
shooting range, I was kind of

1007
01:01:02,800 –> 01:01:07,100
shitty when I Hot there and
within like an hour, like I had

1008
01:01:07,100 –> 01:01:11,000
amazing muscle memory.
Like like it like it’s a thing,

1009
01:01:11,000 –> 01:01:14,800
you can develop and I just, I
don’t know, maybe having it

1010
01:01:14,800 –> 01:01:18,300
implanted in your head that
you’re the best around and

1011
01:01:18,308 –> 01:01:20,200
nothing’s ever going to keep you
down.

1012
01:01:20,500 –> 01:01:24,900
The key though, is that you
spent an hour literally

1013
01:01:24,900 –> 01:01:29,100
practicing shooting and that
makes you better at shooting.

1014
01:01:29,400 –> 01:01:34,100
Whereas if you in this, it’s
shown or at least this is How

1015
01:01:34,100 –> 01:01:38,100
its told, you know, he fires 11
lever action rifle, first to

1016
01:01:38,100 –> 01:01:40,800
demonstrate his Marksmanship,
which first of all is going to

1017
01:01:40,800 –> 01:01:44,100
produce way different results
than that pistol, right?

1018
01:01:44,200 –> 01:01:48,500
And then he’s given his
conditioning and then we are

1019
01:01:48,500 –> 01:01:53,000
shown him firing a pistol and
supposedly being much more

1020
01:01:53,000 –> 01:01:56,000
accurate.
That is a very different kind of

1021
01:01:56,000 –> 01:02:00,100
situation than going and
practicing for an hour and

1022
01:02:00,100 –> 01:02:03,600
getting better at using the same
kind of gun.

1023
01:02:04,100 –> 01:02:06,800
Like it’s easier to aim a pistol
than it is.

1024
01:02:06,800 –> 01:02:10,400
A hand lever action rifle that
has a lot more kick.

1025
01:02:11,100 –> 01:02:14,700
They had him shoot that pistol
before he went and got the

1026
01:02:14,700 –> 01:02:19,300
programming to it yet they but
and then he got better at that.

1027
01:02:19,300 –> 01:02:21,600
Like that’s the thing he got
better at, right?

1028
01:02:21,600 –> 01:02:25,900
I understand but I just yeah
this this is just where it

1029
01:02:25,900 –> 01:02:29,800
starts to really strained.
My credibility as far as him

1030
01:02:29,800 –> 01:02:35,100
being mind-controlled and again,
I’m This is something where

1031
01:02:35,100 –> 01:02:39,100
again, I have to be clear, I’m
not saying that I any of what

1032
01:02:39,100 –> 01:02:41,100
I’m saying here makes me not
believe that.

1033
01:02:41,100 –> 01:02:43,700
Sirhan Sirhan was programmed or
anything like that.

1034
01:02:44,000 –> 01:02:47,300
I’m just saying that.
I don’t think this program does

1035
01:02:47,300 –> 01:02:50,600
a particularly good job of
making that argument.

1036
01:02:50,700 –> 01:02:55,300
Yeah.
Maybe I feel like they there’s

1037
01:02:55,300 –> 01:03:00,100
obviously a lot of steps left
out and he alludes to that right

1038
01:03:00,100 –> 01:03:03,200
from time to time.
They’re like at the end of this

1039
01:03:03,200 –> 01:03:05,600
segment.
Says this really slick thing

1040
01:03:05,600 –> 01:03:08,600
where he goes, it doesn’t matter
how many bull’s-eyes he hit,

1041
01:03:08,700 –> 01:03:10,400
right?
It’s just that he’s hitting

1042
01:03:10,400 –> 01:03:12,700
more.
Now, that’s like that.

1043
01:03:12,700 –> 01:03:16,400
Could just be the product of
like if you play a video game,

1044
01:03:16,400 –> 01:03:19,200
your shitty at it, and then like
an hour later, you’re a little

1045
01:03:19,200 –> 01:03:20,500
better.
Exactly.

1046
01:03:20,500 –> 01:03:23,200
And, and this is all I’m saying
is I agreed.

1047
01:03:23,200 –> 01:03:28,100
There were a lot of steps left
out that is part of the magic

1048
01:03:28,100 –> 01:03:31,100
trick that he is playing on us
the viewer.

1049
01:03:31,200 –> 01:03:33,300
Like that’s, that’s all I’m
saying.

1050
01:03:33,300 –> 01:03:36,700
Is he He’s telling us that one
thing is happening and another

1051
01:03:36,700 –> 01:03:40,200
thing is actually happening
which is classic a magic trick,

1052
01:03:40,200 –> 01:03:42,300
right?
What did you think of the next

1053
01:03:42,300 –> 01:03:46,600
part which was the Amnesia bit?
Was that was the Amnesia thing

1054
01:03:46,600 –> 01:03:50,500
was that before or after the the
restaurant where he fires a

1055
01:03:50,500 –> 01:03:57,400
water pistol, the all of that is
part of the Amnesia bit, right?

1056
01:03:57,400 –> 01:04:03,800
Where the because Sirhan Sirhan
a lot of what he says is he just

1057
01:04:04,000 –> 01:04:09,000
Doesn’t remember doing this or
even shooting at all?

1058
01:04:09,000 –> 01:04:14,000
And he’s been denied, parole. 14
times at least at the time of

1059
01:04:14,000 –> 01:04:18,300
this been denied Pearl. 14 times
basically for that reason.

1060
01:04:18,400 –> 01:04:24,000
Because he cannot consistently
give details of what he did that

1061
01:04:24,000 –> 01:04:27,400
night and he’s not super
remorseful for it.

1062
01:04:27,600 –> 01:04:30,700
There’s that one interview you
brought up in the last episode.

1063
01:04:30,700 –> 01:04:36,700
Yes, which I feel like him being
up for Or parole might explain

1064
01:04:36,700 –> 01:04:38,400
that interview.
Yeah.

1065
01:04:38,700 –> 01:04:43,400
Like because that’s the one
deviation right from his story

1066
01:04:43,400 –> 01:04:46,300
and it’s either that he’s been
lying this whole time or in

1067
01:04:46,300 –> 01:04:48,800
1989.
He was like, well, they said, if

1068
01:04:48,800 –> 01:04:51,800
I’m remorseful and I admit
they’ll let me out, right?

1069
01:04:51,900 –> 01:04:53,600
And he did that.
And they might have been like,

1070
01:04:53,700 –> 01:04:57,100
no, no still not enough.
No, no totally, yeah.

1071
01:04:57,100 –> 01:04:57,900
No.
That’s the thing.

1072
01:04:57,900 –> 01:05:03,600
And again, that is a huge
question that is going to be

1073
01:05:03,600 –> 01:05:04,200
difficult.
Cold.

1074
01:05:04,200 –> 01:05:08,600
If may be impossible to ever
answer for certain, but the

1075
01:05:08,600 –> 01:05:12,300
problem again that I have with
this episode that were basically

1076
01:05:12,300 –> 01:05:15,800
talking about the whole time is
that, that’s his framing for

1077
01:05:15,800 –> 01:05:19,400
this.
Is that this whole experiment as

1078
01:05:19,400 –> 01:05:24,800
he calls it is a demonstration
of how a person can be

1079
01:05:24,800 –> 01:05:29,900
programmed in that way.
And I just don’t think that it

1080
01:05:29,900 –> 01:05:33,700
makes an argument for that it
compelling at all.

1081
01:05:34,900 –> 01:05:38,800
It just doesn’t work for me.
What did you think of the

1082
01:05:38,800 –> 01:05:43,500
Amnesia experiments?
Basically, what he does is he

1083
01:05:43,800 –> 01:05:46,300
throughout the whole episode, he
just touches this kid on the

1084
01:05:46,300 –> 01:05:48,700
shoulder and the kid’s head goes
down and it’s like, all right,

1085
01:05:48,700 –> 01:05:50,100
you’re being hypnotized again, I
guess.

1086
01:05:50,700 –> 01:05:53,800
Yeah.
And he introduces the cell phone

1087
01:05:53,800 –> 01:05:58,700
ringtone that supposed to be a
trigger right for this kid to

1088
01:05:59,200 –> 01:06:03,400
commit, an act like whatever
act, they implant in his head.

1089
01:06:04,000 –> 01:06:08,500
Then he also says, when you see
this polka dot pattern, that’s

1090
01:06:08,500 –> 01:06:10,800
going to be a trigger, but also
you’re not going to remember it

1091
01:06:11,200 –> 01:06:13,200
laughter.
And he did.

1092
01:06:13,200 –> 01:06:16,000
The first thing he does is he’s
like, I’m going to guess your

1093
01:06:16,000 –> 01:06:19,500
ATM pin number, right?
And this is after he’s in

1094
01:06:19,500 –> 01:06:22,700
planted, this pattern thing in
the kid’s head and he goes.

1095
01:06:22,700 –> 01:06:26,400
All right, I’m going to guess
your PIN number and they’re

1096
01:06:26,400 –> 01:06:29,900
standing next to a screen that
has this like swirl pattern on

1097
01:06:29,900 –> 01:06:33,800
it and the kids like all right,
go ahead and then the pattern on

1098
01:06:33,800 –> 01:06:36,900
the The screen changes to that
polka dot pattern, right.

1099
01:06:36,900 –> 01:06:39,900
And Derren Brown goes, tell me
your PIN number and the kid

1100
01:06:39,900 –> 01:06:43,500
tells him and then the pattern
changes back and Derren Brown

1101
01:06:43,500 –> 01:06:49,200
goes 1054, right?
And what we are to believe

1102
01:06:49,300 –> 01:06:54,400
happened in that moment is that
this kid was programmed, to tell

1103
01:06:54,400 –> 01:06:58,500
Derren, Brown his pin number.
And to not remember that he did

1104
01:06:58,500 –> 01:07:02,100
that, he does it a few times.
He does it with his shoe one.

1105
01:07:02,700 –> 01:07:06,500
The shoe thing.
Yeah, he does it in a restaurant

1106
01:07:06,500 –> 01:07:11,900
where he hasn’t like shoot a guy
with a water pistol with like

1107
01:07:11,900 –> 01:07:14,100
that’s like filled with like red
goo.

1108
01:07:14,300 –> 01:07:16,900
Yeah.
Yeah.

1109
01:07:16,900 –> 01:07:21,200
And I mean, yeah like that one,
it’s hard to know like this is

1110
01:07:21,200 –> 01:07:27,100
where it gets to be really hard
to know if and you know you as a

1111
01:07:27,100 –> 01:07:30,800
certain point you have to take
like the kids word that he

1112
01:07:30,800 –> 01:07:36,400
doesn’t remember any of this.
And I’m sorry, it’s hard for,

1113
01:07:36,400 –> 01:07:39,600
it’s hard for me to do that
because he went to a Derren

1114
01:07:39,600 –> 01:07:42,000
Brown Show and he’s been
spending a lot of time with them

1115
01:07:42,000 –> 01:07:44,400
Brown.
He’s an, obviously a fan.

1116
01:07:44,400 –> 01:07:47,900
He was whittled down out of an
audience of like a hundred

1117
01:07:47,900 –> 01:07:51,300
people or whatever like it’s
just I don’t know, man.

1118
01:07:51,400 –> 01:07:54,700
That’s that’s just not
compelling evidence that he

1119
01:07:54,700 –> 01:07:57,400
actually is forgetting what he’s
doing.

1120
01:07:57,400 –> 01:08:01,800
That’s so easy to Stage that
it’s way easier to Stage than it

1121
01:08:01,808 –> 01:08:06,400
is to actually do.
Did you think of the big moment,

1122
01:08:06,400 –> 01:08:09,200
right?
The final scene where they

1123
01:08:09,200 –> 01:08:13,300
ending?
He’s told that he’s okay.

1124
01:08:13,500 –> 01:08:16,300
I was Stephen Fry for some
reason.

1125
01:08:16,899 –> 01:08:19,399
Well, did he?
It seemed like he was going to

1126
01:08:19,399 –> 01:08:23,200
meet Darren Brown afterwards,
but he’s going to see Steven

1127
01:08:23,200 –> 01:08:24,000
for.
I don’t know.

1128
01:08:24,300 –> 01:08:29,000
I do want to say, okay, so they
give, they bring out this case

1129
01:08:29,000 –> 01:08:32,399
that has a gun in it, and they
show the kid, the loaded gun,

1130
01:08:32,399 –> 01:08:35,000
they’re like this, but this gun
has three bullets in it.

1131
01:08:35,000 –> 01:08:37,800
You need to give this to Derren
Brown after the show.

1132
01:08:38,100 –> 01:08:42,300
Look like, even if he hadn’t
been told what he’s supposed to

1133
01:08:42,300 –> 01:08:45,100
do, he’s gone through all this
shit where Derren Brown has been

1134
01:08:45,100 –> 01:08:48,399
talking about trying to program
someone to shoot somebody even

1135
01:08:48,399 –> 01:08:52,500
if he’s not told Specific
Instructions like I’m sorry he’s

1136
01:08:52,500 –> 01:08:55,100
gonna know what what he needs to
do in this moment.

1137
01:08:55,100 –> 01:08:59,200
It’s not hard.
Did you not feel because here’s

1138
01:08:59,200 –> 01:09:03,300
the thing, even if this kid I
mean, he’s obviously a Derren

1139
01:09:03,300 –> 01:09:05,000
Brown Fan.
Yeah.

1140
01:09:05,100 –> 01:09:09,899
Did you not feel like there was
a bit where after he hears the

1141
01:09:09,899 –> 01:09:14,100
cell phone ringtone?
He sees the polkadot dress

1142
01:09:14,399 –> 01:09:16,300
woman.
Literally turns around and says

1143
01:09:16,300 –> 01:09:17,700
Stephen Fry.
Is your target?

1144
01:09:17,700 –> 01:09:21,700
Yeah, you’re you’re talking to
Stephen Fry, there’s a very long

1145
01:09:21,700 –> 01:09:25,899
delay, right?
Where that kid seems like he’s

1146
01:09:25,899 –> 01:09:29,700
really thinking about maybe but
you can project any thoughts

1147
01:09:29,700 –> 01:09:32,100
that you want onto that pause.
That’s not enough.

1148
01:09:32,200 –> 01:09:36,200
I ain’t no.
But Even if it’s even if up to

1149
01:09:36,200 –> 01:09:39,200
that point he was like all right
this is all been fake and I know

1150
01:09:39,200 –> 01:09:43,600
it’s been fake but is this fake
like yes he would go that it is

1151
01:09:43,600 –> 01:09:47,100
Derren Brown was very famous
with this adventure shot and he

1152
01:09:47,100 –> 01:09:49,500
was famous for doing these.
He had just done the thing

1153
01:09:49,500 –> 01:09:51,899
called the Heist where he liked
Rick.

1154
01:09:51,899 –> 01:09:54,900
The guy into committing bank
robbery and shooting someone

1155
01:09:54,900 –> 01:09:58,200
like, this is just in his
wheelhouse of things to do.

1156
01:09:58,200 –> 01:10:00,900
Of course, he would know that it
that’s what it’s like, if

1157
01:10:00,900 –> 01:10:04,900
anything, like if you want to
say that, he Been given Specific

1158
01:10:04,900 –> 01:10:07,500
Instructions, then you can
project onto that.

1159
01:10:07,500 –> 01:10:11,400
Pause that he’s remembering the
forehead thing and then he’s

1160
01:10:11,400 –> 01:10:14,600
remembering the gun, like it,
like there’s just nothing.

1161
01:10:14,600 –> 01:10:17,700
You can project anything you
want on to like the few seconds

1162
01:10:17,700 –> 01:10:21,100
apposite, they show?
Yeah, I just it’s just not

1163
01:10:21,100 –> 01:10:25,400
enough for me and whereas I
like, you know, I can’t believe

1164
01:10:25,400 –> 01:10:30,400
CIA or whatever, you know,
programming techniques, and

1165
01:10:30,400 –> 01:10:35,100
those sorts of things exist
because the CIA Would be a lot

1166
01:10:35,100 –> 01:10:37,100
more ruthless in their
programming.

1167
01:10:37,100 –> 01:10:40,800
The Derren Brown is able to be
on television, they would use

1168
01:10:40,800 –> 01:10:45,700
drugs, they would use an insane
strobe effects and those sorts

1169
01:10:45,700 –> 01:10:48,900
of things to literally program a
person.

1170
01:10:49,100 –> 01:10:53,700
But by Aaron Browns got that TV
money, he does know, but no TV

1171
01:10:53,700 –> 01:10:57,600
stations kind of fund like and
also they would have shown that

1172
01:10:57,600 –> 01:11:00,200
like if they’re really trying
and again the only reason I’m

1173
01:11:00,200 –> 01:11:05,600
really being so nitpicky on.
Are you asking Them to violate

1174
01:11:05,700 –> 01:11:11,700
the 1952 hypnotism act.
Olivia, you know, you know what,

1175
01:11:11,700 –> 01:11:13,200
that’s right.
And I would never do that.

1176
01:11:13,200 –> 01:11:15,700
But I just want to say, the only
reason I’m nitpicking about this

1177
01:11:15,800 –> 01:11:20,400
at all because otherwise it’s a
very fun trick or prank or

1178
01:11:20,400 –> 01:11:22,300
whatever you want to call it.
I think it’s, you know, it’s

1179
01:11:22,300 –> 01:11:27,100
decent television but he just
keeps referring.

1180
01:11:27,100 –> 01:11:33,000
He just keeps comparing it to
Sirhan sirhan’s, you know?

1181
01:11:33,800 –> 01:11:37,400
Ramming and I just don’t think
that that connection is valid at

1182
01:11:37,400 –> 01:11:41,700
all, because he is not drawing a
random person who doesn’t know

1183
01:11:41,700 –> 01:11:43,900
who he is, and has never had a
connection to it.

1184
01:11:43,900 –> 01:11:47,900
He’s drawing from people who not
only know who he is, but went to

1185
01:11:47,900 –> 01:11:50,800
his show and wanted to be a part
of something like that.

1186
01:11:50,900 –> 01:11:55,500
But that doesn’t mean Sirhan
Sirhan wasn’t profiled in some

1187
01:11:55,500 –> 01:11:57,300
way.
No, absolutely not.

1188
01:11:57,300 –> 01:11:59,200
No, I’m not saying that.
That’s not what I’m saying.

1189
01:11:59,200 –> 01:12:02,000
But but that, in that case,
what’s the difference?

1190
01:12:02,000 –> 01:12:06,100
Darren Browns, just Filing.
Because even that like if you

1191
01:12:06,100 –> 01:12:10,200
were in the audience at a Derren
Brown Show, you’re probably not

1192
01:12:10,200 –> 01:12:13,600
the person who’s going to end up
and I mean, you specifically, do

1193
01:12:13,600 –> 01:12:17,500
I know you actually mean?
I know, I mean, I don’t think I

1194
01:12:17,500 –> 01:12:20,300
would be the person who gets
pulled out of this audience to

1195
01:12:20,300 –> 01:12:24,800
shoot, Stephen Fry know, but
also like that.

1196
01:12:24,800 –> 01:12:28,000
It’s that selection take.
Again, it the selection

1197
01:12:28,000 –> 01:12:31,000
technique isn’t for mind
control.

1198
01:12:31,000 –> 01:12:34,400
The selection technique is for
people who will Just kind of go

1199
01:12:34,400 –> 01:12:36,700
along with its kind of like the
push.

1200
01:12:36,700 –> 01:12:38,900
It’s like oh we’ll just kind of
go along with what they’re

1201
01:12:38,900 –> 01:12:41,800
doing.
I just it’s the, it’s the Sirhan

1202
01:12:41,800 –> 01:12:46,300
Sirhan connection alone that I
really have like a logical

1203
01:12:46,300 –> 01:12:49,000
problem with.
I just don’t think it works as

1204
01:12:49,000 –> 01:12:53,100
an analogy and, you know, like
he does get up and he shoots

1205
01:12:53,100 –> 01:12:55,600
Stephen Fry.
And it’s very weird that no one

1206
01:12:56,000 –> 01:12:57,600
in the audience reacts.
Yeah.

1207
01:12:57,600 –> 01:12:59,500
But people are just like, oh
shit.

1208
01:12:59,500 –> 01:13:02,800
And then you find out that the
people weren’t there, just to

1209
01:13:02,800 –> 01:13:07,600
see Stephen Fry, As the program
had said that they were again.

1210
01:13:07,600 –> 01:13:11,100
This is yes.
He says, in the program that the

1211
01:13:11,100 –> 01:13:14,000
people speak there were two
audiences that he refers to at

1212
01:13:14,000 –> 01:13:17,400
different points in the
voiceover, but the audience at

1213
01:13:17,400 –> 01:13:20,400
the Stephen Fry thing was told
that they had no idea that

1214
01:13:20,400 –> 01:13:24,000
anything was going to happen.
But they all knew that they were

1215
01:13:24,000 –> 01:13:27,500
there and that Derren Brown was
involved with stuff because they

1216
01:13:27,500 –> 01:13:29,700
had the sign, you know,
giveaways.

1217
01:13:29,700 –> 01:13:33,300
And so when it happened, people
just kind of knew what was you

1218
01:13:33,300 –> 01:13:35,200
know that.
Something weird was going on,

1219
01:13:35,200 –> 01:13:38,100
but that’s probably for the
best.

1220
01:13:38,100 –> 01:13:40,500
I mean, sure.
And again, I’m not saying this

1221
01:13:40,500 –> 01:13:43,200
is, but because of this is
because that was, that was my

1222
01:13:43,200 –> 01:13:46,500
question to as holy shit,
someone shooting in a packed

1223
01:13:46,500 –> 01:13:48,500
theater.
You’re not all up and running

1224
01:13:48,500 –> 01:13:51,200
right now.
Like I was it’s also not in

1225
01:13:51,208 –> 01:13:53,700
America so they don’t know
exactly what to do in that kind

1226
01:13:53,700 –> 01:14:00,300
of.
Yeah I’m like oh is not that.

1227
01:14:00,300 –> 01:14:07,000
That is any of this is wrong.
Poor fishy or bad for the, for

1228
01:14:07,000 –> 01:14:12,100
the experiment, but it’s, it’s,
the trick is on us, the viewers.

1229
01:14:12,100 –> 01:14:14,400
Like that’s where the trick
lies.

1230
01:14:14,400 –> 01:14:18,700
That’s just a further example of
he’s using like because earlier

1231
01:14:18,700 –> 01:14:25,200
again he uses a polygraph test
at an earlier Point Christa’s.

1232
01:14:25,500 –> 01:14:29,300
Yeah.
And you know, he passes the

1233
01:14:29,300 –> 01:14:33,300
polygraph test even when he is
lying about things that we know

1234
01:14:33,300 –> 01:14:39,400
that he did but a polygraph test
is not an accurate reading of

1235
01:14:39,900 –> 01:14:43,800
truth and light.
And what it does measure really

1236
01:14:43,900 –> 01:14:48,500
is anxiety and nervousness and
heart rate and that sort of

1237
01:14:48,500 –> 01:14:51,600
thing.
And if you are there knowing

1238
01:14:51,800 –> 01:14:56,800
that you were just a person in a
TV show, none of its real, then

1239
01:14:56,800 –> 01:14:59,200
you will probably have a
positive result when you’re

1240
01:14:59,200 –> 01:15:01,600
lying on that because it’s not a
big deal.

1241
01:15:01,600 –> 01:15:04,700
You’re not under investigation
for a Or anything.

1242
01:15:04,900 –> 01:15:09,200
It’s just like a normal thing.
Yeah, maybe like I never, I’ve

1243
01:15:09,200 –> 01:15:13,400
never like, I get that
polygraphs aren’t admissible in

1244
01:15:13,400 –> 01:15:15,300
court.
Not only are they not admissible

1245
01:15:15,300 –> 01:15:17,800
in court but they are fully
fallible.

1246
01:15:17,900 –> 01:15:22,400
They are just not an accurate
machine of course, but people do

1247
01:15:22,400 –> 01:15:27,300
pass and fail them right based
on what a reader who has bias is

1248
01:15:27,300 –> 01:15:33,600
telling and you know based on
there’s just no real just pass.

1249
01:15:33,700 –> 01:15:37,800
Has to be so much.
Widespread corruption for this

1250
01:15:37,800 –> 01:15:40,700
to be fake.
Like polygraph no not the

1251
01:15:40,700 –> 01:15:46,100
polygraph like what Derren Brown
is doing in the like I don’t.

1252
01:15:46,100 –> 01:15:49,700
That would be a whole conspiracy
that all of these people working

1253
01:15:49,700 –> 01:15:53,700
on this project.
All like no one was like, yeah,

1254
01:15:53,700 –> 01:15:57,000
this is bullshit because it
happened with the Russian

1255
01:15:57,000 –> 01:15:59,200
Roulette thing when they were
like no, no, no, those are

1256
01:15:59,200 –> 01:16:01,700
blanks.
It was but no it I don’t think

1257
01:16:01,700 –> 01:16:06,900
that requires a conspiracy.
It’s just how Show Business

1258
01:16:06,900 –> 01:16:08,300
works.
There’s going to be lots of

1259
01:16:08,300 –> 01:16:11,700
people who are in on stuff and
I’m not saying that necessarily

1260
01:16:11,700 –> 01:16:14,100
that they are telling this kid
what to do.

1261
01:16:14,100 –> 01:16:19,800
Again, it doesn’t require, this
doesn’t require the kid to be

1262
01:16:19,800 –> 01:16:22,800
told a specific thing.
It just requires him to have

1263
01:16:22,800 –> 01:16:26,800
gone through the steps that he
has been going through and

1264
01:16:26,800 –> 01:16:30,500
understand that.
He, this is a continued, he was

1265
01:16:30,500 –> 01:16:33,500
given a gun case with a loaded
gun in it.

1266
01:16:33,700 –> 01:16:38,400
And sent to sit in an audience.
I’m sorry it’s just not a thing

1267
01:16:38,400 –> 01:16:42,400
that is happening that happens
and that ever seen Stephen Fry

1268
01:16:42,400 –> 01:16:44,800
talk.
Well, that is fair and I have

1269
01:16:44,800 –> 01:16:49,600
not and I imagined I would at
least want something there.

1270
01:16:49,600 –> 01:16:52,900
I mean everything else because
that would be mean and illegal

1271
01:16:52,900 –> 01:16:57,400
but everyone gets a gun, what’s
talks?

1272
01:16:57,400 –> 01:17:01,200
But yeah, I’m just saying like
he’s receiving a gun and told

1273
01:17:01,200 –> 01:17:03,600
that he is going to be giving it
to Derren Brown.

1274
01:17:03,900 –> 01:17:07,000
So even if he doesn’t have
Specific Instructions at this

1275
01:17:07,000 –> 01:17:11,100
point, he knows what he’s got to
do and he knows that he’s going

1276
01:17:11,100 –> 01:17:13,900
to be filmed.
And that this is going, nothing

1277
01:17:13,900 –> 01:17:17,300
bad is going to happen.
That’s just how it is.

1278
01:17:17,400 –> 01:17:20,800
There’s only one way, we’re
going to resolve this.

1279
01:17:21,700 –> 01:17:26,400
We’re going to have to program.
Someone to commit a murder or at

1280
01:17:26,400 –> 01:17:29,100
least a crime.
Like, it doesn’t a piece, it can

1281
01:17:29,100 –> 01:17:31,800
be like, like a ransomware
attacks.

1282
01:17:31,800 –> 01:17:33,500
Something know if we if we can
do.

1283
01:17:33,700 –> 01:17:37,900
This, if we can replicate this
with no camera trickery or

1284
01:17:37,900 –> 01:17:42,100
anything, and just me like being
there and watching this whole

1285
01:17:42,100 –> 01:17:45,800
process happen, then I will
fully admit that I’m wrong and

1286
01:17:45,800 –> 01:17:49,000
that Derren Brown is not a
clever, Illusionist and

1287
01:17:49,000 –> 01:17:52,700
Mentalist, but is in fact,
someone who can brainwash

1288
01:17:52,700 –> 01:17:54,800
somebody into killing Stephen
Fry.

1289
01:17:54,800 –> 01:18:00,500
So I’m willing to objectively
participate in this experiment

1290
01:18:00,500 –> 01:18:06,000
with Olivia and I reach out on.
We’re looking for a rate in a

1291
01:18:06,600 –> 01:18:10,500
non partial audience, just we’re
going to pick someone at random,

1292
01:18:10,700 –> 01:18:13,200
right?
And well, but see, but here’s

1293
01:18:13,200 –> 01:18:16,200
the thing, we can’t, this it
can’t be from someone who

1294
01:18:16,200 –> 01:18:19,900
listens to this show.
That joke I was making is right,

1295
01:18:20,600 –> 01:18:22,700
I’m sorry.
I’m still taking this seriously.

1296
01:18:23,500 –> 01:18:26,900
It would have to be like someone
from Craigslist or something,

1297
01:18:27,000 –> 01:18:29,000
it’s got.
Yeah, I did want to read this

1298
01:18:29,000 –> 01:18:30,900
quote that I found a friend of
mine.

1299
01:18:30,900 –> 01:18:33,300
His girlfriend were in the
audience of the Stephen Fry

1300
01:18:33,300 –> 01:18:33,800
talk.
Talk.

1301
01:18:33,800 –> 01:18:36,300
And apparently, they had been
up, they had applied to be

1302
01:18:36,300 –> 01:18:39,500
involved in the Derren Brown
show, but then receive tickets

1303
01:18:39,500 –> 01:18:40,800
for her.
Stephen Fry talk.

1304
01:18:40,800 –> 01:18:43,900
So has a suspicion that Darren
would be involved in some way.

1305
01:18:44,100 –> 01:18:47,400
And then during the talk,
obviously, as was seen Stephen

1306
01:18:47,400 –> 01:18:49,600
was shot and it did all happen
for real.

1307
01:18:49,700 –> 01:18:52,900
They heard the shots and saw
Chris with the gun above them

1308
01:18:53,000 –> 01:18:56,000
and then Derren Brown came on
stage quite quickly and explain

1309
01:18:56,000 –> 01:18:59,200
the situation as would seen
apparently, all the audience had

1310
01:18:59,200 –> 01:19:02,300
to sign forms, not the leak.
Anything out about the show so

1311
01:19:02,300 –> 01:19:05,500
it would be a surprise.
In it aired.

1312
01:19:05,600 –> 01:19:10,100
So you know, I’m not doubting
that this event happened, where

1313
01:19:10,200 –> 01:19:14,300
a man fired blanks from the
balcony at Stephen Fry who had

1314
01:19:14,300 –> 01:19:17,700
squibs and his jacket, but like
I am sorry.

1315
01:19:17,700 –> 01:19:21,500
I just don’t think that Derren
Brown is a talented enough man

1316
01:19:21,600 –> 01:19:26,200
to program someone to murder.
I just don’t I think he’s a very

1317
01:19:26,200 –> 01:19:30,200
talented Entertainer and seems
to be a really good showman and

1318
01:19:30,400 –> 01:19:37,200
Illusionist and Mentalist but
CIA programmer, he is not, we

1319
01:19:37,200 –> 01:19:40,000
gotta get a CI, a programmer on
the side.

1320
01:19:40,000 –> 01:19:43,400
So I’m this podcast, not this
episode that’s unrealistic

1321
01:19:43,400 –> 01:19:47,200
movie.
Get that guy from that, Jesse

1322
01:19:47,200 –> 01:19:50,100
Ventura episode, The Men Who
Stare at Goats guy.

1323
01:19:50,100 –> 01:19:53,000
Yeah.
That guy that when you Stare at

1324
01:19:53,000 –> 01:19:56,200
Goats guy, I want that white
van, the general, that all that

1325
01:19:56,200 –> 01:20:00,000
recording equipment, but the
general was like, actually there

1326
01:20:00,000 –> 01:20:03,500
and he seems like a fun
interview I think Paul.

1327
01:20:03,700 –> 01:20:06,600
Tell guy would be fun too.
Yeah, that’s true.

1328
01:20:06,700 –> 01:20:08,800
I was just asked him to do
karate on say.

1329
01:20:08,800 –> 01:20:11,800
Maybe maybe we could just start
another podcast where we just

1330
01:20:11,800 –> 01:20:15,000
interview people, who were
interviewed on Conspiracy Theory

1331
01:20:15,000 –> 01:20:17,300
with Jesse Ventura, I could be
fun.

1332
01:20:17,500 –> 01:20:18,900
That would be a whole lot of
fun.

1333
01:20:21,000 –> 01:20:23,600
Well, until we get that podcast
fired up.

1334
01:20:24,500 –> 01:20:27,200
I think this is an episode.
You can watch this Derren Brown

1335
01:20:27,200 –> 01:20:30,600
special on YouTube.
Yeah, watch it and decide for

1336
01:20:30,600 –> 01:20:31,900
yourself.
I exactly.

1337
01:20:32,100 –> 01:20:35,000
I still buy sir.
Han sir Han story over the

1338
01:20:35,000 –> 01:20:38,700
government Story.
I mean, day, I buy almost

1339
01:20:38,700 –> 01:20:41,700
anybody story over the
government story about anything.

1340
01:20:42,100 –> 01:20:43,700
You know.
I don’t know what happened with

1341
01:20:43,700 –> 01:20:45,200
Robert Kennedy.
I don’t know.

1342
01:20:45,200 –> 01:20:48,400
And no one will ever know.
Probably it was, no, of course

1343
01:20:48,400 –> 01:20:49,900
not.
That’ll they’ll just be lost in

1344
01:20:49,907 –> 01:20:53,400
the sands of time.
But like, do I believe that it’s

1345
01:20:53,400 –> 01:20:57,100
possible for a government
agency, or something like that

1346
01:20:57,100 –> 01:21:00,800
to program, something to someone
to do something that they might,

1347
01:21:00,800 –> 01:21:03,400
otherwise not be inclined to do
absolutely.

1348
01:21:03,700 –> 01:21:06,300
Do I think they’re in brown, did
it in this episode TV?

1349
01:21:06,700 –> 01:21:10,300
No, I do not.
I’m sorry, but like I think it

1350
01:21:10,300 –> 01:21:13,800
was, you know, pretty fun.
I probably, I might watch the

1351
01:21:13,800 –> 01:21:15,900
push.
It didn’t really strike me as

1352
01:21:15,900 –> 01:21:19,500
something that I would find
super interesting but you know I

1353
01:21:19,500 –> 01:21:25,300
like the push is distressing.
Yeah cuz it’s one of those where

1354
01:21:25,600 –> 01:21:30,900
he asks people to be a part of
the show, right?

1355
01:21:30,900 –> 01:21:33,500
But then he tells them like they
didn’t get it in.

1356
01:21:33,600 –> 01:21:37,100
And he just doesn’t follow up.
And that’s a thing that he does

1357
01:21:37,100 –> 01:21:38,700
a lot.
He like, interviews people and

1358
01:21:38,700 –> 01:21:42,000
then slick, six months later, he
like actually puts them in some.

1359
01:21:42,000 –> 01:21:43,500
Yeah.
And then he just starts

1360
01:21:43,500 –> 01:21:49,600
intervening in your life.
In writing over ways like the

1361
01:21:49,600 –> 01:21:58,600
CIA is because I would never be
able to trust anything that ever

1362
01:21:58,600 –> 01:22:02,700
happens ever again.
But that that’s what he does

1363
01:22:02,700 –> 01:22:06,500
with the push and Actually these
people get catering jobs, right?

1364
01:22:06,500 –> 01:22:09,100
Yeah.
And at this catering job all

1365
01:22:09,100 –> 01:22:14,100
this insane shit happens, right?
That culminates in them being

1366
01:22:14,100 –> 01:22:16,500
coerced into pushing someone on.
Yeah.

1367
01:22:16,500 –> 01:22:21,100
And like, and, you know, and it
gets a stressing to watch and I,

1368
01:22:21,100 –> 01:22:25,800
like I said, I hate prank shows.
I just don’t find them fun at

1369
01:22:25,800 –> 01:22:27,600
all.
Basically, I just don’t find

1370
01:22:27,600 –> 01:22:30,200
them entertaining.
I think it’s just sucks logical

1371
01:22:30,200 –> 01:22:34,100
experiment in it.
So yeah, so like I just probably

1372
01:22:34,100 –> 01:22:37,600
won’t wash watch the push
because it sounds like an even

1373
01:22:37,600 –> 01:22:42,300
worse prank show.
But like I mean like because in

1374
01:22:42,300 –> 01:22:46,000
that one like again those people
are coming away from that like

1375
01:22:46,000 –> 01:22:48,600
fuck, right?
Well in either the kind of

1376
01:22:48,600 –> 01:22:51,400
person who would commit murder.
And then there’s people like

1377
01:22:51,400 –> 01:22:55,400
when I was again, when I was
doing research for this episode,

1378
01:22:55,500 –> 01:23:02,000
I came across people on comments
and forums all over the Internet

1379
01:23:02,000 –> 01:23:05,100
who are basically like call
Thing for those people who

1380
01:23:05,100 –> 01:23:08,800
actually did push the guy off to
like be arrested.

1381
01:23:08,900 –> 01:23:12,700
Yeah, and shit.
And I think maybe if that is the

1382
01:23:12,700 –> 01:23:17,600
result of your prank show then
maybe you shouldn’t have done

1383
01:23:17,600 –> 01:23:19,500
that.
That’s kind of fucked up.

1384
01:23:19,600 –> 01:23:22,500
You might have crossed the line
like that’s, you know, I’m not

1385
01:23:22,500 –> 01:23:25,200
saying that like you can’t ever
do anything that pushes

1386
01:23:25,200 –> 01:23:29,900
boundaries but like Jesus, man.
Like, you shouldn’t have like

1387
01:23:29,900 –> 01:23:34,800
literal like mobs after people
because As they, you know, were

1388
01:23:34,800 –> 01:23:37,400
put into a situation that was
unreasonable.

1389
01:23:37,800 –> 01:23:40,900
They volunteered.
I would probably kill someone in

1390
01:23:40,900 –> 01:23:43,900
that situation.
You know, fuck, yeah.

1391
01:23:44,300 –> 01:23:47,100
You gotta watch it like, no, no,
that’s not.

1392
01:23:47,100 –> 01:23:51,100
That’s definitely one where I’m
sure he had to screen pretty

1393
01:23:51,100 –> 01:23:53,800
hard.
Oh, I’m sure you’re getting.

1394
01:23:54,100 –> 01:23:56,000
I know he puts a lot of work
into this.

1395
01:23:56,000 –> 01:23:59,400
It takes a lot of effort like
which here’s the thing.

1396
01:23:59,500 –> 01:24:02,100
I brought up the Assassins
earlier.

1397
01:24:02,400 –> 01:24:04,800
Yeah.
The the Korea documentary.

1398
01:24:04,900 –> 01:24:12,100
It is not unlike a Derren Brown
experiment because they take to

1399
01:24:12,100 –> 01:24:17,600
completely innocent women and
turn them into assassins in the

1400
01:24:17,600 –> 01:24:22,300
span of about a month and the
whole time, the girls have no

1401
01:24:22,300 –> 01:24:23,700
idea, it’s happening.
Yeah.

1402
01:24:23,700 –> 01:24:26,800
And that’s what you never take
part in a prank show.

1403
01:24:26,900 –> 01:24:30,400
Ever, exactly.
You never know it could, and I’m

1404
01:24:30,400 –> 01:24:33,400
only kind of being half serious
about this.

1405
01:24:33,500 –> 01:24:37,700
Because like again, that’s not
proving that anyone can be

1406
01:24:37,700 –> 01:24:40,100
programmed to murder someone
against their will.

1407
01:24:40,100 –> 01:24:42,900
That’s just proving that if you
put someone in the right

1408
01:24:42,900 –> 01:24:47,300
situation, then they can be, you
know, framed for something that

1409
01:24:47,300 –> 01:24:49,600
they weren’t otherwise willing
to do.

1410
01:24:49,600 –> 01:24:51,900
Like yeah.
And again, I’m not saying that

1411
01:24:51,900 –> 01:24:54,800
sir hunt that’s not what
happened with Sirhan Sirhan, but

1412
01:24:54,800 –> 01:24:57,700
like I’m sorry I was on a prank
show, right?

1413
01:24:57,700 –> 01:24:59,300
Yeah, baby.
Maybe he was.

1414
01:24:59,500 –> 01:25:01,700
Yeah, maybe he thought he was
gonna be on like to tell the

1415
01:25:01,700 –> 01:25:03,200
truth or something.
I don’t know.

1416
01:25:03,600 –> 01:25:06,200
Trying to think of like old
laughing.

1417
01:25:06,300 –> 01:25:08,300
Yeah.
Some I try to think like waka

1418
01:25:08,300 –> 01:25:12,600
waka nonfiction laughing
obviously it’s not that, it’s

1419
01:25:12,600 –> 01:25:14,300
okay.
Yeah.

1420
01:25:14,300 –> 01:25:17,100
So anyway this show is, it’s
interesting.

1421
01:25:17,100 –> 01:25:19,100
I might watch a couple more of
those things.

1422
01:25:19,100 –> 01:25:20,600
I really don’t want to watch the
push.

1423
01:25:20,600 –> 01:25:21,900
It just doesn’t sound like
something.

1424
01:25:21,900 –> 01:25:25,000
I would like to find the other
episodes of the show.

1425
01:25:25,000 –> 01:25:26,500
There’s only.
Yeah, right.

1426
01:25:26,500 –> 01:25:29,500
There’s only 40 That’s British
TV for, you know, they do like

1427
01:25:29,500 –> 01:25:31,500
for.
Yeah, there’s I think this is

1428
01:25:31,500 –> 01:25:35,800
the one where he coerces Someone
into confessing to the death of

1429
01:25:35,800 –> 01:25:39,000
a celebrity, which is the one
you said you saw a part of?

1430
01:25:39,100 –> 01:25:44,400
Yeah, there’s one about the
science of luck which I, right.

1431
01:25:44,400 –> 01:25:47,400
That sounds, the least if no
one’s getting abused.

1432
01:25:48,100 –> 01:25:50,400
I mean, come on.
Yeah, you know.

1433
01:25:50,400 –> 01:25:53,700
And like I always say, if you
find any of this stuff,

1434
01:25:53,700 –> 01:25:57,400
interesting, watch, watch the
magic magic school people, give

1435
01:25:57,400 –> 01:26:01,000
magic a really bad rap, but
like, and you know, and I know

1436
01:26:01,000 –> 01:26:07,700
that pendula is kind of a weird
Fucking guy now, but like watch

1437
01:26:07,700 –> 01:26:11,300
any of their Penn & teller’s
magic shows, were they kind of

1438
01:26:11,300 –> 01:26:14,400
go into a lot of the stuff that
we’re talking about while also

1439
01:26:14,400 –> 01:26:19,000
doing magic, tricks, or fool us,
which was their British TV show

1440
01:26:19,600 –> 01:26:23,300
where they like, have people on
to do these sorts of Tricks.

1441
01:26:23,300 –> 01:26:24,600
Not like it.
Exactly.

1442
01:26:24,600 –> 01:26:28,700
But Mentalist go on there and
then they either guess or don’t

1443
01:26:28,700 –> 01:26:32,400
guess how the trick was done so
good show so but yeah like that

1444
01:26:32,400 –> 01:26:35,100
sounds interesting.
It’s if you not seen fullest I

1445
01:26:35,100 –> 01:26:38,100
highly recommend it now it’s
really good.

1446
01:26:38,400 –> 01:26:41,300
But yeah, it’s because it’s all
like amateurs and stuff who are

1447
01:26:41,300 –> 01:26:43,100
trying to get big so it’s really
cool.

1448
01:26:43,200 –> 01:26:44,300
Nice.
But yeah.

1449
01:26:44,300 –> 01:26:48,300
Like I don’t know, I’m kind of
mixed on Derren Brown as a guy.

1450
01:26:48,800 –> 01:26:53,700
I’m not I’m not super into him.
Yeah, it comes and goes and he

1451
01:26:53,700 –> 01:26:58,200
is definitely in recent years
wading into just kind of

1452
01:26:58,200 –> 01:27:02,300
terrorizing people and they get
in.

1453
01:27:02,300 –> 01:27:04,000
Yeah, it’s like the David.
Anything.

1454
01:27:04,100 –> 01:27:08,300
He’s just kind of his Fame as a
magician kind of went to his

1455
01:27:08,300 –> 01:27:11,800
head and now his things are just
getting bigger and bigger and

1456
01:27:11,800 –> 01:27:16,100
more elaborate and I just find
that way less compelling than

1457
01:27:16,100 –> 01:27:18,900
his older stuff that I walked
where he’s just kind of doing

1458
01:27:18,900 –> 01:27:21,600
card tricks for guy.
And yeah that’s that’s a talent

1459
01:27:21,600 –> 01:27:24,700
that I can really admire.
I can’t like it’s hard for me to

1460
01:27:24,700 –> 01:27:28,400
admire the talent to put on a
giant Stage production to

1461
01:27:28,400 –> 01:27:32,200
convince someone to commit
murder, it’s less in my

1462
01:27:32,200 –> 01:27:34,900
admirable, you know.
No, here’s here’s kind of my

1463
01:27:34,900 –> 01:27:39,200
other problem with it.
It’s the same problem I had like

1464
01:27:39,200 –> 01:27:43,800
after 9/11 when there would be
all these news reports about

1465
01:27:43,800 –> 01:27:45,900
like see these nuclear reactors
here.

1466
01:27:46,200 –> 01:27:49,200
Yeah any terrorist could blow
them up like at any second and

1467
01:27:49,200 –> 01:27:53,100
it’s like, well don’t say that
like you don’t, you don’t say

1468
01:27:53,100 –> 01:27:57,600
that publicly and was stuff like
this, if the government’s not

1469
01:27:57,600 –> 01:28:01,500
doing it, like, if they weren’t
before Derren Brown, right are

1470
01:28:01,500 –> 01:28:03,300
now.
Yeah, I mean why.

1471
01:28:03,500 –> 01:28:06,500
Maybe but again I just don’t
think that these are very good

1472
01:28:06,500 –> 01:28:09,500
methods for doing that but
government would have way better

1473
01:28:09,500 –> 01:28:11,600
methods.
Yeah, of course.

1474
01:28:12,200 –> 01:28:15,600
But that’s not comforting.
No, I’m not trying to be

1475
01:28:15,600 –> 01:28:18,800
comforting to say it like, you
know, the government doesn’t

1476
01:28:18,800 –> 01:28:22,600
need to watch a TV show and be
like, oh look at this guy doing

1477
01:28:22,600 –> 01:28:25,200
stage hypnosis, I bet we could
do something like that.

1478
01:28:25,200 –> 01:28:29,100
They’ve been doing MKUltra for
years like, you know, so they

1479
01:28:29,100 –> 01:28:31,800
already they’re way ahead of
Darren, perhaps this was the

1480
01:28:31,800 –> 01:28:36,500
whole culmination of a MK Ultra
they was like we got to got to

1481
01:28:36,500 –> 01:28:41,600
get into the prank.
Show biz got to get rid of

1482
01:28:41,600 –> 01:28:47,100
Stephen.
Fry was very funny to just an

1483
01:28:47,100 –> 01:28:52,900
elaborate plot, a MI6 to kill
Stephen Fry decades-long, what

1484
01:28:52,900 –> 01:28:56,100
did he do?
This guy’s gonna become a huge

1485
01:28:56,100 –> 01:29:01,600
transphobia in the future.
Yeah, there was that so I think

1486
01:29:01,600 –> 01:29:04,300
that’s an episode it.
Forget it.

1487
01:29:04,300 –> 01:29:06,500
This episode was longer than I
thought it was going to be.

1488
01:29:06,600 –> 01:29:09,000
It’s very fun though.
There’s a lot of stuff to go

1489
01:29:09,000 –> 01:29:12,300
over with this like, you know so
yeah I liked it.

1490
01:29:12,500 –> 01:29:15,900
Derren Brown is a complex figure
weird guy.

1491
01:29:15,900 –> 01:29:18,100
Chill out there.
And yeah I don’t think I would

1492
01:29:18,100 –> 01:29:22,100
say I don’t normally end the
podcast by saying well we’ve

1493
01:29:22,100 –> 01:29:26,100
presented the evidence go decide
for yourself but in this case

1494
01:29:26,100 –> 01:29:30,100
just fucking go out and Darren
Brown stuff and take your temp

1495
01:29:30,200 –> 01:29:33,100
after and you feel.
Yeah there’s episodes on

1496
01:29:33,100 –> 01:29:34,400
YouTube.
You can watch it.

1497
01:29:34,400 –> 01:29:36,700
It’s going to sit with you one
way or another.

1498
01:29:36,800 –> 01:29:39,300
Yeah.
Do we have anything to plug

1499
01:29:39,300 –> 01:29:43,000
before we get out of here?
Same as always find me on

1500
01:29:43,000 –> 01:29:46,400
Twitter and twitch at hi there.
Hide our that’s about it right

1501
01:29:46,400 –> 01:29:49,900
now.
Patreon.com gun pops.

1502
01:29:49,900 –> 01:29:52,200
Gun pops Network that super cast
dot tick.

1503
01:29:52,600 –> 01:29:56,000
You can subscribe to conspiracy
the show for four dollars a

1504
01:29:56,008 –> 01:29:58,400
month Heller.
Subscribe to everything on the

1505
01:29:58,407 –> 01:30:01,800
network for $10 a month or just
keep listening for free.

1506
01:30:01,900 –> 01:30:03,800
We love you either.
Away.

1507
01:30:03,800 –> 01:30:05,300
All right, let’s get out of
here.

1508
01:30:05,300 –> 01:30:07,800
Olivia say goodbye.
Goodbye.

1509
01:30:08,000 –> 01:30:09,400
Goodbye everybody.
We love you.