Conspiracy! The Show 195: Kill Jack Bauer

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Which of the transparent you
this world.

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Have a chat room?
Hey everybody.

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Welcome to a very special
episode of conspiracy the show.

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I’m Adam Todd Brown.
Who are you?

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Hey, I’m Olivia hide our, I
think that makes us your hosts

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Olivia.
How’s it going?

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Uh, you know, going to go pretty
good on like a weird Jag.

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Like, I feel like hyped up, you
know, like, My energy is like,

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through the roof because I just
watched so much 24 within the

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last 24 hours.
It was my own personal 24.

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I’m very excited to talk about
what we’re talking about this

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week because we very briefly
mentioned 24 on this week’s

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episode of unpopular opinion.
Yeah, in that the makers of 24

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should be held accountable for
their crimes against the

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military.
I don’t even know how to put it,

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where the victims of 24 besides
Muslims.

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And right anyone who?
Yeah, to conduct Warfare in a

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quote-unquote, ethical manner,
right?

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Yeah, I think Muslims and to a
secondary extent, all Arabs and

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Middle Eastern peoples.
Are the are the real victims of

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24, followed closely by the last
shreds of military ethics in the

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United.
It’s yeah, this is a thing.

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I hadn’t thought about much
recently the TV show 24 and so

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we briefly mentioned it on the
episode of unpopular opinion and

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then an article came out like
minutes after we recorded that

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episode.
Yeah.

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We’re Kiefer Sutherland was
talking about.

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Hey, maybe we should bring 24
back and oh, I don’t know.

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I think maybe we shouldn’t.
Yeah, I know.

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We should it.
I think it’s a bad idea.

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I think the previous attempts to
do this have proven that.

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It was a bad idea 24 to me.
I know these aren’t direct

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comparisons.
So don’t make it seem like I’m

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directly equating these things,
but 24 has taken on kind of a

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birth of the nation.
Mmm, feel.

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Yeah.
We’re for a long time.

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People viewed Birth of a Nation
as this achievement in film

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making and then there was this
whole other part of the country.

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That was Yeah, but you get what
that movies about, right?

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Right, like there are I get
that.

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They did some cool filmmaking
things.

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But right there are some
problems with that movie, you

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know, that’s usually people came
around and I feel like 24 is

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sort of in that same vein where
to this day people will be like,

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yeah, but it was such a good
show like it.

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Yeah, very well written the
cinematography, like, one of the

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Articles will link to it.
Literally says, well, what’s

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lost in all All of the torture
debate is how great the

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cinematography was.
And it’s like, Yeah, because it

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was glamorizing torture.
So the sea at ography doesn’t

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matter.
And also, the cinematography

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isn’t that good?
Yeah, it’s really nice.

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Like I look like I said, I
watched a lot of this show.

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Yeah, and that’s really for
another article rightfully

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points out that we thought this
show was great before, like the

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wire existed, right?
This was really the last Great

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Neck.
Work TV or last?

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No no.
No.

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The Good Wife, which was
legitimate was the last great

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Network TV show.
Fuck you.

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Okay, the guys, when it’s so
good.

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I will fly to India five her.
I know that The Good Wife is

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good weave.
I know I need to watch it.

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But what I, the show that I want
to bring up as I am want to do

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on many episodes of a nun,
podcast is a little television

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program called Lost.
That came out in 2004 just three

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years.
After the first, the premiere of

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24, but like, it feels like it
was made 15 years after 24 feels

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so ugly cinematically and
otherwise in comparison to Lost

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which like I just consider that
to me is, at least for the

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decade of 2000 to 2010.
Like, as far as Network, dramas,

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I would say.
Lost the wire and probably

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Breaking Bad weightless the 20th
or why I’m so early.

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And it did like it was a cool
concept and it did seem really

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well extroverted.
But I think they’re right that

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those other shows came so much
quicker after that that when you

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look at 24 now, not so much not
so great.

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I’m specifically comparing
Network like as The Wider it is

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Bo it had HBO money and Breaking
Bad was a MC.

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Breaking off of Mad Men and
trying to do, right?

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Something else.
Whereas lost was on ABC and

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like, it looks a thousand times
better than any episodes of 24

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has ever looked.
It just in general, and it also

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tackles some of the similar
themes in a much better way.

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And is way more action-packed
but like it’s not like lost

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versus 24.
I’m just like that’s kind of my

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Benchmark when I’m thinking
about network shows of the era.

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I don’t want to Fairly judge 24,
I guess by, like, comparing it

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to things that it couldn’t
possibly be better than, but

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also like, it’s still not as
good as its contemporaries.

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Yeah, and it’s interesting that
you have basically never watched

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24 because it makes again
Counterpoint for me, a person

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who watched all of 24.
I watched the shit out of 24.

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Yeah, but it was almost kind of
a baton Switch situation.

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Like you have to think about how
soon after 9/11 24 premiered.

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It was wax after 9/11.
And there’s a reason it was

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allowed to Premier, that soon
after 9/11.

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And it’s because that first
season isn’t remotely about

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Middle Eastern terrorists.
There’s nothing in it, aside

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from a scene in the trailer
where a plane explodes in the

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sky, which they end up editing
out of the show.

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Nothing is done.
It’s done by a white woman.

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Yeah.
Well, hey, what are you?

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Which part the oh, yeah.
Oh, yeah.

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Yeah.
Yeah.

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Blowing up in the actual
episode.

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Like that’s one of the episodes
I watched and it’s a white woman

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who puts up the play.
Yeah, spoiler alert.

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But yeah, the main terrorists in
the first season is a white

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woman.
And so even though it was so

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fresh off at 911.
Well, didn’t feel like a

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reference to 911.
It just felt like a show about

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terrorism.
All the terrorists were tied to

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fucking Slobodan milosevic.
Exactly.

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Yeah.
This is the thing.

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It feels like it because it was
made pre 9/11.

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It really feels like the last
pre 9/11 action movie in a way.

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Like, it really has that Vibe of
all the terrorists stories, pre

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9/11, in the thing about the
first season is it’s good, like,

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at least.
Yeah, it’s fun.

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Like, at the time.
Yeah, the concept was neat like

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the Idea of 24 episodes of a
show that cover each hour of one

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day.
Like yeah, that was the whole

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idea.
First.

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They initially plan this as a
rom-com and then eventually

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landed on terrorism drama, but
it didn’t have any of that 9/11

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stank on it in that first
season.

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So it felt fine watching Jack
Bauer torture.

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Most of it is people like right
and there’s that kind.

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Context, you could take it as
well.

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This is just a TV show.
But once they make that pivot in

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season two to wear.
Okay, well, 911 is happened.

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And now, this is all about
fighting Middle Eastern

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terrorist, the show, just got
weird and gross after that.

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Yeah.
And like progressively, so, if

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that’s the right word to use,
for a show that more and more

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uncomfortably racist, as it goes
along, you know, progressively

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racist, right?
Of course.

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I mean, like, you know,
listening to some of the

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creative people involved.
That’s like kind of how they saw

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their roles is guys.
Yeah, progressively racist.

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It’s interesting.
I only watch the pilot of the

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first season, so I can’t judge
it, like, very accurately, but

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it also seemed like torture was
less of a big deal.

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From what I could tell about the
first season.

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It didn’t happen as much.
Maybe it was more of like a once

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or twice, kind of thing.
Yeah, far, be it from For me to

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push conspiracy theories, but I
think I’m like there had to be

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some degree of government
cooperation in this show as it

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goes along.
And I have that way at the end

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of the notes, but YOLO, I guess.
Like one of the things you’ll

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read in articles about this show
now is that well, they were like

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way better political
commentators than even The Daily

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Show.
Like they knew what the

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government was doing.
Like they.

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It was almost like they were
predicting what the Vermont was

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going to do next and it’s like
this show is a commercial for

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what the government was going to
do that next like this show

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normalized what the Bush
Administration was doing in

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response to 9/11.
I know it could be a

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coincidence, but it doesn’t
necessarily have to be like the

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CIA has a Hollywood liaison
department where they just write

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consult on TV shows and movie
projects that they want to turn

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out a certain.
Certain way like they’re very

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easily could have been meetings
between the right-wing.

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Fuck stick who made this show
and the Bush Administration

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about hey, maybe send the
message that we need torture.

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Well, not only is it a
commercial for the Bush

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Administration?
It is giving them ideas, like,

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literally people in the
administration people working in

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the military at the time, by
their own admission.

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It’s giving them ideas.
And that in itself is, Is a

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mind-boggling thing to kind of
consider?

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Yeah, well link to some
interviews with the various

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showrunners of this and at one
point one of them.

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I think it’s Howard Gordon.
Talks about how they would just

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have like writers room
brainstorming sessions on

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torture methods.
Yeah, because there’s so much

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torture depicted in this show.
They have to get creative with

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it.
Like they can’t just write do

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the same thing over and over my
personal.

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Turret if I can put 1/4 for
nomination, there’s a scene

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early in, it might be season one
probably see, maybe season 2,

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but what’s special about it?
For one thing?

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He’s interrogating a middle-aged
white couple who live in the

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suburbs, which that’s refreshing
and he has the husband and wife

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tied up.
He wants the information from

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the husband and he shoots the
husband in the knee and the

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husband’s like listen, dude, you
do.

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Ever the fuck you want to me.
I’m not going to tell you a

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fucking thing and Jack Bauer
immediately shoots, the wife in

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the knee next and let me tell
you that L Al’s in water and

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that had to be like half of this
show was just all right.

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Well, yeah.
Okay.

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Well now we’ve arrived at the
14th torture scene in this

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episode.
How are we going to make it

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right?
Like in by like season five and

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six Jack Bauer is cutting
people’s heads off with hack.

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Seesaws and like just bite his
jugular veins.

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And it’s like this show
shouldn’t have survived past

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season 1.
Season, one was read it.

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Either should have stopped after
season.

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One out of respect for 9/11 or
season 2 should have been the

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rom-com.
They were like, yeah, just like

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how groundbreaking that’s a good
thing that have been if every

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season tackled a different
subject but in that Ray 24-hour,

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Matt, that would have been neat.
But instead, they started

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bootlicking, the bush
administration’s.

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00:12:59,800 –> 00:13:02,000
Well.
Yeah, I think the problem that

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wrong, I think the problem there
is that would require the

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creator of the show to not be a
giant fucking asshole, which by

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all accounts, is what Joel sir
now is it seems like Joel sir

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now Howard Gordon.
Howard Gordon?

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Yeah, he at least like he’s one
of the guys who kind of

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sometimes pretends to be.
E, not a total like right-wing

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Maniac, but like he’s still is
like totally an immoral

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Hollywood caricature.
It feels a lot, like Hannity and

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00:13:36,700 –> 00:13:39,200
combs.
Remember when Sean Hannity used

219
00:13:39,200 –> 00:13:43,200
to have a liberal counterpart on
his two eyes.

220
00:13:43,200 –> 00:13:45,900
I do get still on Fox News.
Stop.

221
00:13:45,900 –> 00:13:49,500
Yeah, and that’s why Combs
doesn’t have a job now probably

222
00:13:49,600 –> 00:13:51,100
like yeah?
What?

223
00:13:51,100 –> 00:13:52,800
I don’t even know what happened
to him.

224
00:13:52,800 –> 00:13:56,800
I haven’t heard that name.
In 85 years.

225
00:13:56,800 –> 00:13:59,300
Yeah, who’s hiring Combs after
the hit?

226
00:13:59,400 –> 00:14:01,200
No way.
CNN hired.

227
00:14:01,200 –> 00:14:04,500
Combs, who would, I wouldn’t
know.

228
00:14:04,500 –> 00:14:09,400
Yeah, it even without the pivot
to, this being a pro torture

229
00:14:09,400 –> 00:14:11,400
show.
It just got stupid.

230
00:14:11,400 –> 00:14:14,800
Like yeah, season 2, Jack
Bauer’s daughter.

231
00:14:14,800 –> 00:14:18,300
Who I believe already got
kidnapped season 1.

232
00:14:18,300 –> 00:14:21,000
Yes.
She gets kidnapped again and

233
00:14:21,000 –> 00:14:24,300
season 2, but also at one point
gets stalked by a coup.

234
00:14:24,400 –> 00:14:27,100
Cougar like an actual Google,
like the animal.

235
00:14:27,600 –> 00:14:31,900
It is one of the most
notoriously bad television show

236
00:14:31,900 –> 00:14:34,700
writing moments of all time in
this show.

237
00:14:34,700 –> 00:14:37,500
Survived for so many years after
that.

238
00:14:37,600 –> 00:14:42,400
Yeah, that was easy to think
this shows good for one season

239
00:14:42,600 –> 00:14:46,900
and it makes it till 2010.
Yeah, I still feel like there’s

240
00:14:46,900 –> 00:14:50,300
government involvement there.
Probably, I don’t think carries

241
00:14:50,300 –> 00:14:53,800
on into the Obama Administration
just to make it look good, but

242
00:14:53,800 –> 00:14:55,100
it’s like yeah.
Right.

243
00:14:55,500 –> 00:14:59,600
Know what this show was.
It was our commercial for how we

244
00:14:59,600 –> 00:15:01,500
wanted to torture people.
Yeah.

245
00:15:01,500 –> 00:15:07,600
I mean, it was extremely popular
like for as blatantly right wing

246
00:15:07,600 –> 00:15:14,500
as it is and like watching it
now it just is so right wing,

247
00:15:14,600 –> 00:15:20,000
there was still the very common
sentiment among otherwise

248
00:15:20,000 –> 00:15:24,000
liberal media professionals like
reporters.

249
00:15:24,400 –> 00:15:28,100
People and like people who would
do television Recaps and that

250
00:15:28,100 –> 00:15:31,500
sort of thing in the early days
of that who were just like,

251
00:15:31,500 –> 00:15:34,600
yeah, sure.
Like the torture stuff is kind

252
00:15:34,600 –> 00:15:38,000
of gross but like, it’s just so
good.

253
00:15:38,000 –> 00:15:42,100
It’s just it’s so exciting and
fun to watch.

254
00:15:42,200 –> 00:15:47,300
Yeah, the first big piece of
Internet content that I ever did

255
00:15:47,300 –> 00:15:52,100
that I actually attracted an
audience was a fake script for

256
00:15:52,100 –> 00:15:57,200
an episode of 24 that was just
about Jack Bauer eating and

257
00:15:57,200 –> 00:16:01,100
going to the bathroom.
It’s and also like getting

258
00:16:01,100 –> 00:16:05,600
around La really quick.
That was in the first episode.

259
00:16:05,600 –> 00:16:09,600
Even in Wild to see some of the
way he like, leaves the house

260
00:16:09,600 –> 00:16:14,300
and has a phone call and is at
like the fucking office within

261
00:16:14,300 –> 00:16:17,000
the like three minutes, like
it’s insane.

262
00:16:17,100 –> 00:16:20,600
This show had no reason to be
set in Los Angeles.

263
00:16:21,400 –> 00:16:22,700
It’s wild.
That’s a thing.

264
00:16:22,700 –> 00:16:24,300
They should have fixed
immediately.

265
00:16:24,400 –> 00:16:28,700
Only because well in theory,
there should have been several

266
00:16:28,700 –> 00:16:32,300
like bottle episodes that were
just Jack Bauer dealing with

267
00:16:32,300 –> 00:16:35,300
shit from his car.
In traffic.

268
00:16:35,400 –> 00:16:39,000
I prefer hey 5 and there was not
like he would just get places in

269
00:16:39,300 –> 00:16:42,200
like 10 minutes and it’s like
nope.

270
00:16:42,200 –> 00:16:44,700
Does he have a helicopter?
You know, there was never a

271
00:16:44,700 –> 00:16:49,800
scene where Jack Bauer goes into
a gas station and buys trucker

272
00:16:49,800 –> 00:16:50,900
speed.
Yeah.

273
00:16:50,900 –> 00:16:53,400
They’re, yeah, there’s none of
this.

274
00:16:53,600 –> 00:16:58,600
That’s why I should have changed
the entire premise after season

275
00:16:58,600 –> 00:17:03,100
one, because, yeah, people got
too much time to think about

276
00:17:03,100 –> 00:17:05,200
this show.
Yeah, like it’s a thing that’s

277
00:17:05,599 –> 00:17:09,800
come and gone and then now we’d
be making these criticisms and

278
00:17:09,800 –> 00:17:11,599
people would be like, well,
yeah, that’s why it was only one

279
00:17:11,599 –> 00:17:13,700
season, right?
Course, it’s stupid, but it’s

280
00:17:13,700 –> 00:17:16,700
good stupid and it’s like, no,
this goes on to be dangerous.

281
00:17:16,700 –> 00:17:18,400
Stupid.
Very dangerous.

282
00:17:18,400 –> 00:17:23,500
Stupid problem like yea, but the
the whole thing is that it was

283
00:17:23,500 –> 00:17:26,900
so Popular, it just made so much
money.

284
00:17:26,900 –> 00:17:31,300
That very few channels would
ever cancel a show that did, as

285
00:17:31,300 –> 00:17:36,500
well as 24 and that’s the whole
thing fox has not stopped.

286
00:17:36,500 –> 00:17:40,800
Trying to bring this ship back.
No, it initially made it until

287
00:17:40,800 –> 00:17:46,600
2010 that was when which even
that seemed so deep.

288
00:17:46,600 –> 00:17:51,000
Yeah, into the war on terror.
We were like three years into

289
00:17:51,000 –> 00:17:53,400
hope and Guantanamo would be
closed.

290
00:17:53,600 –> 00:17:57,000
Yeah.
By that point and 24 is still on

291
00:17:57,000 –> 00:18:00,300
the air.
Like, 24 is Guantanamo the TV

292
00:18:00,300 –> 00:18:04,100
show.
Yes, literally get like people

293
00:18:04,100 –> 00:18:09,100
in back in 2002, talk about
watching the show and taking

294
00:18:09,100 –> 00:18:13,800
ideas for it and to Guantanamo
and they brought it back for a

295
00:18:13,800 –> 00:18:17,600
12-episode series called 24
Live.

296
00:18:17,600 –> 00:18:20,500
Another Day bullshit.
They see the quality 12.

297
00:18:20,500 –> 00:18:24,300
Yeah, exactly.
How old are you 12 episodes of

298
00:18:24,400 –> 00:18:28,200
Before that makes no sense.
I mean like but you could you

299
00:18:28,200 –> 00:18:31,300
would just have to call a 12.
I think I would be fine with it.

300
00:18:31,800 –> 00:18:36,400
If it was just if they just
titled it 12 men in 2017.

301
00:18:36,400 –> 00:18:39,600
They try to reboot called 24
Legacy.

302
00:18:39,600 –> 00:18:42,000
That is did not involve Jack
Bauer.

303
00:18:42,000 –> 00:18:45,800
It started Corey Hawkins of
yeah, guy who played Dre and

304
00:18:45,800 –> 00:18:48,900
Straight Out of Compton Fame in
the lead actor.

305
00:18:49,200 –> 00:18:51,500
Very good actor.
He’s in.

306
00:18:52,100 –> 00:18:55,700
He plays macduff in The Tragedy
of Beth that’s right.

307
00:18:55,700 –> 00:18:59,500
Yeah, he’s really good in that
but I can’t imagine that shows.

308
00:18:59,500 –> 00:19:00,500
Good.
There’s no way.

309
00:19:00,800 –> 00:19:05,500
I just don’t buy it.
The 24, Legacy lie, or whatever.

310
00:19:05,500 –> 00:19:06,700
It’s called.
Yeah.

311
00:19:06,700 –> 00:19:09,100
Yeah.
I think I may be watched an

312
00:19:09,100 –> 00:19:12,000
episode.
But yeah, it’s like by that

313
00:19:12,000 –> 00:19:15,100
point.
I think a lot of people new 24.

314
00:19:15,500 –> 00:19:18,600
I don’t know, unless he was
going to come back fighting the

315
00:19:18,600 –> 00:19:21,200
proud boys, like right?
No way.

316
00:19:21,300 –> 00:19:25,300
And even then, I’m not going to
normalize the Idea of torture,

317
00:19:25,300 –> 00:19:28,500
even if we’re talking about the
proud boys, because then the

318
00:19:28,500 –> 00:19:31,000
administration that takes power,
next will be like, well, you

319
00:19:31,000 –> 00:19:33,800
thought it was okay for the
proud boys, right, but we can

320
00:19:33,800 –> 00:19:36,100
yeah, you know, I would never, I
would never.

321
00:19:36,300 –> 00:19:40,600
Yeah, and never suggest that.
I just, I can’t imagine a world

322
00:19:40,600 –> 00:19:44,800
where this show still works and
they keep fucking trying.

323
00:19:44,800 –> 00:19:48,900
Yeah, and even after, like I
said, we just talked about it on

324
00:19:48,900 –> 00:19:53,100
on pops briefly and almost as
soon as we finish that episode

325
00:19:53,200 –> 00:19:57,800
this Kiefer Sutherland interview
with GQ Magazine comes out and

326
00:19:57,800 –> 00:20:00,600
he’s talking about wanting to
give 24 another shot.

327
00:20:00,600 –> 00:20:02,000
Here’s a quote.
I miss it.

328
00:20:02,100 –> 00:20:05,400
It was an incredible experience.
I’ve learned that you’re just

329
00:20:05,400 –> 00:20:09,800
better off not to be definitive
about your answer of whether you

330
00:20:09,800 –> 00:20:12,000
will do something or not.
Do something.

331
00:20:12,000 –> 00:20:15,000
I love playing the character.
I do believe the story is

332
00:20:15,000 –> 00:20:17,800
unresolved.
If something were to be written,

333
00:20:17,800 –> 00:20:21,200
that made sense to me and that I
thought was going to contribute

334
00:20:21,200 –> 00:20:23,900
to the franchise, then I would
be behind it.

335
00:20:24,000 –> 00:20:27,400
Even if My participation in that
were to be limited.

336
00:20:27,400 –> 00:20:29,700
Here’s a theory.
I don’t think Kiefer Sutherland

337
00:20:29,900 –> 00:20:31,700
can get any other work right
now.

338
00:20:31,800 –> 00:20:35,000
Yeah, there is a very famous
Freddie, Prinze jr.

339
00:20:35,000 –> 00:20:38,700
Interview from a few years back.
I don’t remember what movie he

340
00:20:38,700 –> 00:20:42,100
was promoting, but they asked
him like something about his

341
00:20:42,100 –> 00:20:46,500
worst onset experience.
And he was like, oh, I did 24

342
00:20:46,500 –> 00:20:50,200
with Kiefer Sutherland.
He is the most unprofessional

343
00:20:50,200 –> 00:20:53,400
person in the world.
He also said that is not me

344
00:20:53,400 –> 00:20:55,700
talking shit.
Shit, anyone who’s worked with

345
00:20:55,700 –> 00:20:57,200
him.
Will tell you that?

346
00:20:57,300 –> 00:21:01,600
Yeah, I feel like Kiefer
Sutherland doesn’t have a lot of

347
00:21:01,800 –> 00:21:04,200
options.
Like I’m sure he’s got, like,

348
00:21:04,200 –> 00:21:07,700
any actor of his pedigree is
going to get jobs.

349
00:21:07,800 –> 00:21:10,000
Absolutely.
There’s a difference between

350
00:21:10,000 –> 00:21:15,900
getting like a direct Amazon
Prime movie, and a 24 reboot.

351
00:21:15,900 –> 00:21:20,400
And I feel like 24 is probably
Kiefer Sutherland’s last.

352
00:21:20,400 –> 00:21:24,200
Yeah, real in road to like major
work.

353
00:21:24,600 –> 00:21:28,700
Yeah, I think it’s his only
piece of cultural cachet at the

354
00:21:28,700 –> 00:21:31,700
moment.
I don’t think the lost boys has

355
00:21:31,700 –> 00:21:34,200
any sort of potential of that
capacity.

356
00:21:34,600 –> 00:21:39,400
And other than that, I don’t
think right now especially to

357
00:21:39,400 –> 00:21:43,200
like, Generations younger than
Millennials.

358
00:21:43,200 –> 00:21:47,300
Even, I don’t think they know
him as anything other than the

359
00:21:47,300 –> 00:21:52,800
guy who was Jack Bauer, he is so
tied to Jack Bauer that this

360
00:21:52,800 –> 00:21:56,000
Variety article.
That will link to which

361
00:21:56,000 –> 00:21:59,500
references the GQ interview.
They just fuck up and call him

362
00:21:59,500 –> 00:22:04,700
Jack Bauer.
This is a quote Bauer told GQ.

363
00:22:04,700 –> 00:22:08,000
He almost quit the show during
its first season when filming

364
00:22:08,000 –> 00:22:11,100
was interrupted by the September
11th terrorist attacks.

365
00:22:12,600 –> 00:22:16,300
That’s got to sting, like that’s
got to be like Jaleel White

366
00:22:16,300 –> 00:22:20,100
getting called article and got
an article or something.

367
00:22:20,300 –> 00:22:23,500
Yeah, I don’t know much about
Kiefer Sutherland’s reputation

368
00:22:23,500 –> 00:22:27,200
as as like a guy on set, but
this is super shocked me that he

369
00:22:27,200 –> 00:22:32,300
might be a bit unprofessional.
I know he’s a big alcoholic.

370
00:22:32,300 –> 00:22:35,500
Like, I don’t know if he’s still
is he could be right in recovery

371
00:22:35,500 –> 00:22:39,200
now, but I’ve never heard any
stories about him being in

372
00:22:39,200 –> 00:22:42,300
recovery, but I’ve heard stories
about him jumping into Christmas

373
00:22:42,300 –> 00:22:44,200
trees in the life that I’ve
heard.

374
00:22:44,200 –> 00:22:45,600
Yeah, I’ve heard some of these
stories.

375
00:22:45,600 –> 00:22:50,200
Yeah, he seems like a character.
That’s sure.

376
00:22:51,200 –> 00:22:54,700
Yeah, I guess Donald kept.
Most of the acting jeans though.

377
00:22:54,700 –> 00:22:57,800
He’s good in some stuff.
Yeah, Kiefer Sutherland’s a good

378
00:22:57,800 –> 00:23:00,500
actor and he’s good as Jack
Bauer.

379
00:23:00,700 –> 00:23:04,500
Yeah.
There’s a reason the role is, as

380
00:23:04,500 –> 00:23:07,300
beloved as it is.
It’s just, you know, not

381
00:23:07,300 –> 00:23:09,700
everyone has the politics we
have.

382
00:23:10,200 –> 00:23:13,000
And once you remove, I mean, The
equation.

383
00:23:13,000 –> 00:23:17,300
Oh man. 24 is a wild romp.
Such a fun ride.

384
00:23:18,200 –> 00:23:21,100
Like once you don’t care about
its impact on the world.

385
00:23:21,100 –> 00:23:24,000
Holy shit.
Are those torture scenes fun?

386
00:23:24,100 –> 00:23:28,800
I see I guess I don’t know.
I was trying to view it fairly

387
00:23:28,800 –> 00:23:32,500
neutrally as much as I’m able to
and it’s fine.

388
00:23:32,900 –> 00:23:36,700
I guess he is good as Jack
power, but that character is

389
00:23:37,000 –> 00:23:39,600
extremely one note.
He is.

390
00:23:39,700 –> 00:23:43,300
Oh, yeah, emotionally unfazed by
I almost everything except for

391
00:23:43,300 –> 00:23:47,800
like a few times that he like
yells and and like feels bad

392
00:23:47,800 –> 00:23:51,900
about something and that like
did he goes back to making cool?

393
00:23:51,900 –> 00:23:54,300
Rational decisions almost
immediately.

394
00:23:55,600 –> 00:23:57,600
We’re kind of jumping around the
notes here.

395
00:23:57,600 –> 00:24:03,700
But at one point the set of 24
is visited by US Army.

396
00:24:03,700 –> 00:24:06,000
Brigadier General, Patrick
Finnegan.

397
00:24:06,000 –> 00:24:11,500
Yeah, but dean of West Point.
So the guy in charge of the

398
00:24:11,500 –> 00:24:15,400
people who teach our best
military people, how to be

399
00:24:15,400 –> 00:24:21,000
military, people shows up at the
set, with three of the best

400
00:24:21,100 –> 00:24:26,200
military and FBI interrogators
in all the The land and is like,

401
00:24:26,200 –> 00:24:29,700
stop it.
You are showing on this show is

402
00:24:29,700 –> 00:24:33,700
toxic.
Yeah, and it is making our jobs

403
00:24:33,700 –> 00:24:38,200
way harder and we’ll get into
that whole meeting more.

404
00:24:38,400 –> 00:24:45,400
Whoo, but this is a quote from
an FBI expert on interrogation

405
00:24:45,400 –> 00:24:49,800
techniques because the defense
that the showrunners gave to

406
00:24:49,800 –> 00:24:52,400
that was well.
Yeah, but it’s pretty obvious

407
00:24:52,400 –> 00:24:54,600
that Jack Bauer is mentally
bothered.

408
00:24:55,200 –> 00:24:59,300
Mike, he takes it really hard
and they’re like he goes on

409
00:24:59,300 –> 00:25:02,100
making completely rational
decisions the rest of his day.

410
00:25:02,400 –> 00:25:05,900
Like if he’s bothered by this at
all, it’s barely which brings up

411
00:25:05,900 –> 00:25:09,800
this quote from Joe Navarro FBI
expert on interrogation

412
00:25:09,800 –> 00:25:12,300
techniques.
Yeah, only I psychopath can

413
00:25:12,300 –> 00:25:16,600
torture and be unaffected.
You don’t want people like that

414
00:25:16,600 –> 00:25:21,100
in your organization.
They are untrustworthy and tend

415
00:25:21,100 –> 00:25:24,500
to have grotesque other
problems.

416
00:25:24,700 –> 00:25:29,900
It’s the end quote.
So it’s not just that 24

417
00:25:30,000 –> 00:25:33,300
depicted torture as a thing.
That worked.

418
00:25:33,400 –> 00:25:35,200
Yeah.
It’s that it depicted it.

419
00:25:35,200 –> 00:25:39,000
As a thing that worked in a way
that impacted the people who in

420
00:25:39,000 –> 00:25:42,900
real life had to decide if
torture was a thing that worked.

421
00:25:43,100 –> 00:25:49,100
Yes, and even when the military
came to 24 and was like, will

422
00:25:49,100 –> 00:25:51,700
you please stop?
They were like, yeah, it’s just

423
00:25:51,700 –> 00:25:53,200
a TV show.
Yep.

424
00:25:53,200 –> 00:25:55,400
Anyone knows it’s just a
Tainment.

425
00:25:55,500 –> 00:25:59,000
And they’re like, no, we teach
the people who need to know that

426
00:25:59,000 –> 00:26:01,400
it’s just entertainment and they
don’t know that.

427
00:26:01,400 –> 00:26:02,300
Yeah.
Or tame?

428
00:26:02,400 –> 00:26:05,200
We please stop.
And they’re still like, no, like

429
00:26:05,200 –> 00:26:09,300
he’s talking about his students
watching the show religiously,

430
00:26:09,300 –> 00:26:14,900
and then coming to class and
applying the ideas of the show

431
00:26:14,900 –> 00:26:21,300
to their lessons, which again
are about how to actually be in

432
00:26:21,300 –> 00:26:27,100
the military, which is wild.
It also sir now didn’t even go

433
00:26:27,100 –> 00:26:30,300
to that meeting.
Yeah, with with them, Joel, sir.

434
00:26:30,300 –> 00:26:32,800
Now, he’s the other creator of
the show.

435
00:26:32,800 –> 00:26:35,500
There’s three main dudes.
Who created the show.

436
00:26:35,500 –> 00:26:39,300
Yeah, Howard Gordon, we will
link to an interview with Howard

437
00:26:39,300 –> 00:26:42,800
Gordon.
Also he is he’s like the Lennon

438
00:26:43,000 –> 00:26:46,100
of the Lennon and McCartney Duo
that creative.

439
00:26:46,100 –> 00:26:47,200
Okay.
In that.

440
00:26:47,200 –> 00:26:50,800
He’s like the progressive one in
like the hip.

441
00:26:50,800 –> 00:26:53,400
Sure.
But also you’re making 24 dude.

442
00:26:53,400 –> 00:26:56,700
Yeah, but then that makes Now
McCartney, I know.

443
00:26:56,700 –> 00:27:00,200
I’m uncomfortable with 82.
Yeah, I don’t know.

444
00:27:00,500 –> 00:27:02,400
I guess there’s a Hannity and
combs.

445
00:27:02,700 –> 00:27:06,200
Wait, I guess.
Yeah, and this guy is homes in

446
00:27:06,200 –> 00:27:10,000
that he’s pretending like oh no,
I’m like the liberal balance.

447
00:27:10,000 –> 00:27:12,000
I’m just a showman.
Yeah.

448
00:27:12,000 –> 00:27:14,000
I just write the shut.
They tell me what to write, and

449
00:27:14,000 –> 00:27:16,200
I just write it and it’s just
always a minute.

450
00:27:16,200 –> 00:27:19,300
No one cares.
Yeah, we do improv sessions

451
00:27:19,300 –> 00:27:22,100
about about torture and all
that.

452
00:27:22,100 –> 00:27:26,300
It’s just so Biz, but then also
here’s This sort of long quote

453
00:27:26,300 –> 00:27:31,000
from that liberal Democrat voice
of the 24 universe and this is

454
00:27:31,000 –> 00:27:33,700
him talking.
This is Howard Gordon talking

455
00:27:33,700 –> 00:27:39,000
about writing 24 after 911.
Yeah, here we go.

456
00:27:39,100 –> 00:27:41,000
Suddenly.
We were getting to write about

457
00:27:41,000 –> 00:27:44,500
this character who had become
America’s hero who wasn’t just

458
00:27:44,500 –> 00:27:48,700
fighting the terrorists but was
really fighting part of, I think

459
00:27:48,700 –> 00:27:52,800
everybody’s rage and confusion
of how much our institutions had

460
00:27:52,800 –> 00:27:56,400
let us down and how much Law
enforcement and intelligence

461
00:27:56,400 –> 00:27:58,500
apparatus had missed this
attack.

462
00:27:58,500 –> 00:28:02,900
Jack cut from the old-school,
cloth of the individual rugged.

463
00:28:02,900 –> 00:28:07,300
American hero, who bucks
Authority and does whatever he

464
00:28:07,300 –> 00:28:11,700
needs to do to get the job done,
and doesn’t throw up excuses.

465
00:28:11,700 –> 00:28:16,000
Was part of the line of Clint
Eastwood and Sylvester Stallone

466
00:28:16,000 –> 00:28:20,000
and Charles Bronson.
It wasn’t a character we’d never

467
00:28:20,000 –> 00:28:22,400
seen before, but it wasn’t
character.

468
00:28:22,400 –> 00:28:24,600
We hadn’t seen quite that
revealing.

469
00:28:24,600 –> 00:28:27,900
Robustly expressed on
television.

470
00:28:27,900 –> 00:28:31,300
I think we the writers really
got to unconsciously express,

471
00:28:31,300 –> 00:28:35,100
our anger at the terrorists in
the bureaucracy.

472
00:28:35,100 –> 00:28:37,700
I think we wrote him the way
people watched him.

473
00:28:38,000 –> 00:28:40,700
And with that kind of, I wish
this guy existed.

474
00:28:40,800 –> 00:28:43,500
I wish I knew somebody like that
who just says it.

475
00:28:43,500 –> 00:28:47,600
Like it is and is not afraid of
the consequences and to just cut

476
00:28:47,600 –> 00:28:49,800
through the bullshit.
I think, in that way, it was

477
00:28:49,800 –> 00:28:52,900
cathartic and I think it was
cathartic for the audience as

478
00:28:52,900 –> 00:28:57,000
well and quote and And I’m glad
that someone who just tells it

479
00:28:57,000 –> 00:28:59,000
like it is and cuts through the
bullshit stuff.

480
00:28:59,000 –> 00:29:02,400
Never manifested in a bad way.
Yeah, exactly.

481
00:29:02,500 –> 00:29:05,200
States.
Like he’s basically saying like,

482
00:29:05,200 –> 00:29:08,700
you know, how Dirty Harry used
to just almost in discriminately

483
00:29:08,700 –> 00:29:11,600
kill, black people.
And then we like found that

484
00:29:11,600 –> 00:29:13,000
entertaining.
Yeah.

485
00:29:13,100 –> 00:29:15,400
Same thing.
Same thing with yeah Power like

486
00:29:15,800 –> 00:29:20,300
dirty hair like that’s such a
Charles Bronson is such a bad

487
00:29:20,300 –> 00:29:24,500
reference to make their way.
Yeah, the question at hand.

488
00:29:24,600 –> 00:29:30,000
Hand is how you treat Muslims in
your show.

489
00:29:30,100 –> 00:29:31,800
He’s like this.
It’s like Dirty Harry.

490
00:29:32,000 –> 00:29:35,100
This is like true.
Yeah, don’t you get it?

491
00:29:35,100 –> 00:29:39,400
It’s like it speaks to our fears
that, you know, it’s like you

492
00:29:39,400 –> 00:29:41,900
get Dirty Harry.
Spoke to Americans fears.

493
00:29:41,900 –> 00:29:44,000
That like black people were
evil.

494
00:29:45,400 –> 00:29:47,300
That’s not those, aren’t the
fears.

495
00:29:47,300 –> 00:29:51,400
You should be drunk to speak to
in this show, but also, like

496
00:29:51,400 –> 00:29:56,100
Dirty Harry was like a, like a
Does make a compelling

497
00:29:56,100 –> 00:30:00,100
character?
Yeah, like I like watching Clint

498
00:30:00,100 –> 00:30:02,800
Eastwood play that.
I mean, obviously I recognized,

499
00:30:02,900 –> 00:30:05,400
you know, the the moral flaws.
I guess.

500
00:30:05,400 –> 00:30:08,800
I’m sounding like a 24 Watcher
but like at the same time

501
00:30:08,800 –> 00:30:12,600
though, there is still I think a
palpable quality difference if

502
00:30:12,600 –> 00:30:15,400
we’re talking about, you know,
when we get into like the later

503
00:30:15,500 –> 00:30:19,500
Deathwish movies than yeah,
sure, but like, you know, the

504
00:30:19,500 –> 00:30:22,500
pretty hairy movies are like
pretty well made for the most

505
00:30:22,500 –> 00:30:25,900
part.
I mean, They’re good movies.

506
00:30:25,900 –> 00:30:30,300
I do wonder if there’s kind of
the same stuff at play there

507
00:30:30,300 –> 00:30:33,200
where it’s like I can’t get in
the heads of the people who

508
00:30:33,200 –> 00:30:35,600
wrote The Dirty Harry movies,
but I don’t doubt.

509
00:30:35,600 –> 00:30:39,300
There was this same idea of.
Well, this is what America’s

510
00:30:39,300 –> 00:30:42,500
worried about that these black
people are just going to and

511
00:30:42,700 –> 00:30:45,700
come kick open the doors of
their diners and robbing

512
00:30:45,700 –> 00:30:48,800
everybody.
And it’s like, I don’t know if

513
00:30:48,800 –> 00:30:52,000
that was everyone’s fear.
No.

514
00:30:52,000 –> 00:30:54,400
No, I don’t know.
It’s very hot.

515
00:30:54,600 –> 00:30:58,400
It’s a very complicated
comparison for him to make it

516
00:30:58,400 –> 00:31:00,500
definitely.
It definitely is.

517
00:31:00,500 –> 00:31:04,900
And I think also what like what
makes the Dirty Harry movies in

518
00:31:04,900 –> 00:31:10,900
the like easier to watch now in
is because we are not as

519
00:31:10,900 –> 00:31:15,600
intimately connected to the
exact political things that

520
00:31:15,600 –> 00:31:19,000
they’re playing on.
We’re like, sure racist

521
00:31:19,000 –> 00:31:21,000
policing, and these sorts of
issues.

522
00:31:21,000 –> 00:31:22,700
Obviously.
He made police net.

523
00:31:22,800 –> 00:31:26,700
No, that’s okay.
Talk about literally like, yeah,

524
00:31:27,000 –> 00:31:32,800
this the exact fears of, like, I
don’t know, there.

525
00:31:33,300 –> 00:31:36,800
I get what you’re saying because
they’re like, you can’t be a cop

526
00:31:36,800 –> 00:31:39,700
and watched Dirty Harry and go.
Yeah, that’s how it’s supposed

527
00:31:39,700 –> 00:31:40,900
to be.
Right?

528
00:31:41,100 –> 00:31:42,900
No one’s going to buy that
argument.

529
00:31:42,900 –> 00:31:45,300
Right?
But this came down, but like, a

530
00:31:45,400 –> 00:31:49,700
actual political debate where
people were like, like it ends

531
00:31:49,700 –> 00:31:53,800
up getting referenced by fucking
Antonin Scalia in a Supreme

532
00:31:53,800 –> 00:31:55,200
Court.
Ruling.

533
00:31:55,200 –> 00:31:57,500
Well, I don’t know if it’s a
Supreme Court ruling now.

534
00:31:57,500 –> 00:32:00,200
He was just a fan.
Yeah, he was commenting on

535
00:32:00,200 –> 00:32:03,400
something and he was like, you
know, you wouldn’t arrest Jack

536
00:32:03,400 –> 00:32:06,400
Bauer for protecting Los Angeles
and it’s like, dude.

537
00:32:06,400 –> 00:32:09,500
That’s a TV show.
What are you talking about?

538
00:32:09,500 –> 00:32:13,300
You can’t bring that into your
legal opinion.

539
00:32:13,300 –> 00:32:17,300
That is a television show.
Yeah, and you find so many

540
00:32:17,300 –> 00:32:21,900
examples of people using that
reasoning like well, yeah,

541
00:32:21,900 –> 00:32:24,200
tortures bad, but just look at
24.

542
00:32:24,500 –> 00:32:27,800
Yeah, gets the job done there.
What happens if the bomb is like

543
00:32:27,800 –> 00:32:32,500
landing at LAX in 15 minutes and
we don’t know if it’s landing at

544
00:32:32,500 –> 00:32:36,200
LAX or John Wayne or Bob Hope
like we’re going to have to

545
00:32:36,200 –> 00:32:37,900
gouge.
Someone’s knee cap out with a

546
00:32:37,900 –> 00:32:42,100
grapefruit spoon to find out
where that bomb is landing.

547
00:32:42,100 –> 00:32:44,400
Like and I should just never
happens.

548
00:32:44,500 –> 00:32:50,500
No it terrorism scenario that
ever ever had like, yeah.

549
00:32:50,600 –> 00:32:53,500
By the time you’re that close to
getting bombed.

550
00:32:53,500 –> 00:32:57,100
You’re getting bombed.
Like exactly known about 9/11

551
00:32:57,100 –> 00:33:00,300
eight minutes before it
happened. 911 Woulda happened.

552
00:33:00,600 –> 00:33:04,300
And I mean that’s, that’s me
looking at it through the 24

553
00:33:04,300 –> 00:33:06,600
lens.
Like we knew about 9/11 like

554
00:33:06,700 –> 00:33:10,200
eight months before it happened,
probably but like it’s just not

555
00:33:10,200 –> 00:33:14,900
a realistic depiction of how
terrorism works but it was

556
00:33:14,900 –> 00:33:18,000
treated as such and that’s what
makes this so much more

557
00:33:18,000 –> 00:33:22,400
dangerous of a show than I think
any other, I sure.

558
00:33:22,400 –> 00:33:25,100
Yeah, I did love.
Little bit.

559
00:33:25,100 –> 00:33:27,900
And talking about that New
Yorker piece where they talk

560
00:33:27,900 –> 00:33:32,400
about the history of the ticking
bomb scenario and they trace it

561
00:33:32,400 –> 00:33:38,800
back to this French book, from
1960, called, listen turians,

562
00:33:39,000 –> 00:33:44,600
which is written during the
French occupation of Algeria.

563
00:33:44,700 –> 00:33:48,900
So I find it very interesting
that this ticking Time.

564
00:33:48,900 –> 00:33:53,700
Bomb scenario is almost
exclusively and going back to

565
00:33:53,700 –> 00:33:57,100
the beginning.
Associated with Arabs and

566
00:33:57,100 –> 00:33:59,300
Muslims.
I find that very, very

567
00:33:59,300 –> 00:34:01,700
interesting and fiction.
Yeah.

568
00:34:01,700 –> 00:34:05,600
And fiction, fiction, obviously,
but fiction, specifically aimed

569
00:34:05,600 –> 00:34:09,500
at inciting violence against
Arabs and Muslims.

570
00:34:09,500 –> 00:34:14,900
Yeah, and that’s where this
shows defense of its use of

571
00:34:14,900 –> 00:34:19,000
torture falls apart is because
all of the torture is being done

572
00:34:19,000 –> 00:34:22,300
in the name of a premise that
literally never happens.

573
00:34:22,400 –> 00:34:27,400
Yes, and what you’ll I hear from
people who actually engage in

574
00:34:27,400 –> 00:34:30,100
trying to fight acts of
terrorism.

575
00:34:30,199 –> 00:34:34,199
I guess is that it’s way more
effective to like give someone a

576
00:34:34,199 –> 00:34:38,300
postcard to send home and then
you like, you get the address of

577
00:34:38,300 –> 00:34:41,800
where their family lives.
Like like it’s shit like that.

578
00:34:41,800 –> 00:34:45,100
It’s like building trust and
like being sneaky, like you

579
00:34:45,100 –> 00:34:48,699
don’t just beat someone with a
rubber hose and expect that

580
00:34:48,900 –> 00:34:52,500
they’re going to capitulate to
your demands, but that’s exactly

581
00:34:52,500 –> 00:34:57,100
how this show portrayed it.
They bring up one scene where

582
00:34:57,300 –> 00:35:01,900
Jack Bauer just walks in the
room and is like, tell me who

583
00:35:01,900 –> 00:35:04,200
you’re working for.
In the guy says, I’m not going

584
00:35:04,200 –> 00:35:07,700
to tell you who I’m working for
and the guy Jack Bauer shoots

585
00:35:07,700 –> 00:35:10,000
him in the knee.
And the guy goes, there’s a bomb

586
00:35:10,000 –> 00:35:12,700
that’s going to go off on a
plane in the sky like 15 minutes

587
00:35:13,000 –> 00:35:17,000
and it’s like this dude.
Is that committed to this and

588
00:35:17,000 –> 00:35:19,500
you think shooting him in the
knee one time, right?

589
00:35:19,500 –> 00:35:22,000
He went like he was expecting
you to go.

590
00:35:22,000 –> 00:35:25,000
All right fine.
I wasn’t really I’m gonna

591
00:35:25,000 –> 00:35:28,800
torture you with your.
He’s just tell me like he was

592
00:35:28,800 –> 00:35:33,000
ready to be shot in the knee.
Yeah, like there’s no way that’s

593
00:35:33,000 –> 00:35:37,000
how that shit works.
And that’s what military people

594
00:35:37,200 –> 00:35:40,400
had issue with.
Yes, like it, you’re not

595
00:35:40,400 –> 00:35:43,100
helping.
Well, thank you’re helping the

596
00:35:43,100 –> 00:35:46,200
war on terror and you’re making
it so much worse.

597
00:35:46,200 –> 00:35:48,200
Also, the war on terror is not
real, right?

598
00:35:48,200 –> 00:35:50,600
No, of course.
Yeah, they can’t say that, but

599
00:35:50,600 –> 00:35:53,700
it is interesting.
And it’s interesting that we’ve

600
00:35:53,700 –> 00:35:57,700
got these Military members who
are almost.

601
00:35:57,700 –> 00:36:00,500
I mean, like they have
experienced an interrogation.

602
00:36:00,500 –> 00:36:04,400
Some of them but also they have
much more of almost a military

603
00:36:04,500 –> 00:36:10,300
historian mindset to them and
they’re horrified at 24 and then

604
00:36:10,300 –> 00:36:16,400
that’s compared with everything
from people above those guys who

605
00:36:16,400 –> 00:36:22,000
are the people that the show 24
portrays as being bureaucratic

606
00:36:22,000 –> 00:36:24,300
wussies who can’t get anything
done.

607
00:36:24,400 –> 00:36:27,800
Done like anybody, who isn’t
who’s above Jack Bauer, who is

608
00:36:27,800 –> 00:36:31,100
one of these guys?
One of these like, on the ground

609
00:36:31,100 –> 00:36:35,000
interrogators, like all the
people that the show portrays is

610
00:36:35,000 –> 00:36:40,100
being fundamentally flawed by
bureaucracy, love the show and

611
00:36:40,100 –> 00:36:42,700
make a point of saying it and
like answer.

612
00:36:42,700 –> 00:36:45,700
Now, laps it up at like there’s
so many quotes.

613
00:36:45,700 –> 00:36:47,300
Were he like this one where he
goes?

614
00:36:47,300 –> 00:36:48,900
Like people in the
administration.

615
00:36:48,900 –> 00:36:52,700
Love love the series to its a
patriotic show.

616
00:36:52,700 –> 00:36:57,400
They should love it.
Jack Bauer is so specifically

617
00:36:57,400 –> 00:37:04,100
described as a patriot by so
many different people across all

618
00:37:04,100 –> 00:37:06,900
of these interviews that we’ve
that we’ve read.

619
00:37:07,100 –> 00:37:11,000
It’s wild that that’s the
defining feature.

620
00:37:11,400 –> 00:37:15,100
And it’s one of the things that
makes me feel like there were

621
00:37:15,100 –> 00:37:18,500
some government involvement in
this show because one of the

622
00:37:18,500 –> 00:37:21,400
Articles will link to its on
Yahoo News.

623
00:37:21,400 –> 00:37:24,900
And it’s one that comes I guess
maybe the closest to I actually

624
00:37:24,900 –> 00:37:28,400
being critical of the legacy of
this show, but it points out

625
00:37:28,400 –> 00:37:31,200
that, at one point, there was
like a huge government

626
00:37:31,200 –> 00:37:34,800
investigation into how we
handled things in the Middle

627
00:37:34,800 –> 00:37:39,400
East in general, and especially
with torture and interrogation.

628
00:37:39,400 –> 00:37:44,800
And whereas, 24 portrays it, as
all these fucking suits, not

629
00:37:44,800 –> 00:37:48,200
wanting to get their hands dirty
and do what needs to be done to

630
00:37:48,200 –> 00:37:51,300
fight terrorism.
Whereas Jack, Bauer was going

631
00:37:51,300 –> 00:37:56,800
rogue as a real Patriot exact.
Torture stuff was coming down

632
00:37:56,800 –> 00:37:59,400
from on high.
They were like, hey, how about

633
00:37:59,400 –> 00:38:02,700
you maybe put a garden hose down
that guy’s throat and fucking

634
00:38:02,700 –> 00:38:04,900
bitch is in it or something.
We don’t know.

635
00:38:05,100 –> 00:38:09,000
See if that works in the people
on the ground were like, yeah.

636
00:38:09,000 –> 00:38:10,800
Just here to get a college
degree.

637
00:38:10,800 –> 00:38:14,200
Are you fucking kidding me?
You want me to do that?

638
00:38:14,300 –> 00:38:17,100
Yeah, and I know it’s like
there’s some Middle Ground

639
00:38:17,100 –> 00:38:18,100
there.
I’m sure.

640
00:38:18,100 –> 00:38:19,700
There’s some people who are like
what?

641
00:38:19,700 –> 00:38:23,900
Yes, I will, of course do that,
but it doesn’t change the fact

642
00:38:23,900 –> 00:38:28,500
that this This wasn’t Rogue
military people committing acts

643
00:38:28,500 –> 00:38:29,800
of torture.
No.

644
00:38:29,800 –> 00:38:32,600
No, this was they were ordered
to do this.

645
00:38:32,700 –> 00:38:35,500
Yeah, it was administrative
policy and they went along with

646
00:38:35,500 –> 00:38:38,600
it to varying degrees of
enthusiasm.

647
00:38:38,700 –> 00:38:44,300
Yeah, but that’s not how 24
depicts it and that is a huge

648
00:38:44,300 –> 00:38:45,900
problem.
Even if you’re like, well, it’s

649
00:38:45,900 –> 00:38:48,300
just entertainment.
Like, when you’re talking that

650
00:38:48,300 –> 00:38:52,700
political climate, and that
point in history, to be a show

651
00:38:52,700 –> 00:38:57,200
about that, like, Got to be
exact, yes, details.

652
00:38:57,300 –> 00:39:02,000
And if the military is showing
up and if Muslim groups are

653
00:39:02,000 –> 00:39:05,000
showing up, there’s I think it
was season six.

654
00:39:05,200 –> 00:39:09,600
That was preceded by a white
public service, announcement

655
00:39:09,600 –> 00:39:12,800
from Jack Bauer where he was
like, hey, even though we make

656
00:39:12,800 –> 00:39:17,000
it seem to be the case, right?
Every Muslim is a terrorist.

657
00:39:17,100 –> 00:39:20,200
That’s just the way we show it
on this show and then the

658
00:39:20,200 –> 00:39:23,300
military believes us, but beyond
that it’s all fucking fake.

659
00:39:23,500 –> 00:39:27,200
It literally.
He sounds like that after-school

660
00:39:27,200 –> 00:39:31,700
special cliche of like we have
fun here.

661
00:39:31,700 –> 00:39:38,700
But in reality not every
American Muslim wants to kill

662
00:39:38,700 –> 00:39:42,900
you and your family.
Yeah, and it’s like once you

663
00:39:42,900 –> 00:39:45,500
realize you need to run that
disclaimer.

664
00:39:46,300 –> 00:39:47,600
It should end with.
Also.

665
00:39:47,600 –> 00:39:53,000
This is the last episode of this
show well forever and, you know,

666
00:39:53,300 –> 00:40:01,200
maybe it Would have if Joel sir
now, wasn’t your classic

667
00:40:01,300 –> 00:40:07,800
oppressed conservative that’s
which is totally like his whole

668
00:40:07,800 –> 00:40:12,600
vibe is just uh direct quote.
It’s easier to come out as gay

669
00:40:12,600 –> 00:40:15,200
than conservative in Hollywood.
These days.

670
00:40:15,600 –> 00:40:19,200
Yeah, Thousand Seven when
conservatives.

671
00:40:19,200 –> 00:40:22,700
Want the land.
It’s like, are you sure?

672
00:40:22,700 –> 00:40:25,700
Are you sure?
When we were canceling, the

673
00:40:25,700 –> 00:40:29,300
Dixie Chicks for saying they
were ashamed of being from the

674
00:40:29,300 –> 00:40:31,600
same state as George Bush.
Yeah.

675
00:40:31,600 –> 00:40:34,900
Are you sure it was more
dangerous to come out as a

676
00:40:34,908 –> 00:40:39,600
conservative, when your
long-running television show up

677
00:40:39,600 –> 00:40:41,800
holding fake conservative
ideals.

678
00:40:42,000 –> 00:40:46,700
Yeah, is a massive hit.
I love this.

679
00:40:46,700 –> 00:40:49,600
This excerpt from The New Yorker
piece.

680
00:40:49,700 –> 00:40:53,700
I really love is Sir.
Now said that?

681
00:40:53,700 –> 00:40:56,700
He found the clue.
Years of noxious Hollywood under

682
00:40:56,700 –> 00:40:59,700
Clinton.
It was like he was their guy.

683
00:40:59,700 –> 00:41:02,700
He said he was the Yuppie baby
boomer.

684
00:41:02,700 –> 00:41:07,800
Narcissist that all of Hollywood
related to Bear during those

685
00:41:07,800 –> 00:41:09,800
Years, sir.
Now we’re called he had

686
00:41:09,800 –> 00:41:12,500
countless arguments with liberal
colleagues.

687
00:41:12,600 –> 00:41:15,000
Some of whom she stopped
speaking to him.

688
00:41:15,200 –> 00:41:17,100
And and I love this quote,
quote.

689
00:41:17,100 –> 00:41:21,600
My feeling is that the Liberals
ideas are wrong.

690
00:41:21,600 –> 00:41:26,800
He said, but they think I am.
Evil and then last year he

691
00:41:26,800 –> 00:41:29,500
contributed two thousand dollars
to the losing campaign of

692
00:41:29,500 –> 00:41:31,100
Pennsylvania’s, Hardline
Republican.

693
00:41:31,100 –> 00:41:34,600
Senator Rick Santorum because he
liked his position on

694
00:41:34,600 –> 00:41:36,800
immigration.
His favorite bumper sticker.

695
00:41:36,800 –> 00:41:41,800
He said is except for ending
slavery, fascism Nazism and

696
00:41:41,800 –> 00:41:45,100
communism.
War has never solved anything.

697
00:41:45,300 –> 00:41:48,900
I wonder what ideas?
What?

698
00:41:48,900 –> 00:41:50,900
Liberal ideas that you thought
were wrong.

699
00:41:50,900 –> 00:41:54,900
That might make them think that
you’re evil that I wonder what

700
00:41:54,900 –> 00:41:57,000
that would be.
Yeah, I can’t imagine it seems

701
00:41:57,000 –> 00:42:00,600
like he’s just misunderstood.
Yeah, no, totally it.

702
00:42:00,600 –> 00:42:03,700
Like, he’s, you know,
Republicans conservatives with

703
00:42:03,700 –> 00:42:06,500
the new oppressed class.
Just like he says in, like,

704
00:42:06,600 –> 00:42:08,400
here’s the thing.
I didn’t know.

705
00:42:08,400 –> 00:42:13,800
All that know when I started
watching this show in 2001.

706
00:42:13,800 –> 00:42:16,400
Yeah, like the internet was very
different.

707
00:42:16,400 –> 00:42:20,200
Like the information about who
was making this show wasn’t as

708
00:42:20,200 –> 00:42:22,500
readily available.
This New Yorker article.

709
00:42:22,500 –> 00:42:26,300
We’re talking about comes out in
Thousand Seven, like that’s six

710
00:42:26,300 –> 00:42:30,200
years after 24, premiered, and a
year.

711
00:42:30,200 –> 00:42:34,000
After it won an Emmy for.
Yes, Primetime drama.

712
00:42:34,000 –> 00:42:38,300
So, there were a lot of years
where I think even people like

713
00:42:38,300 –> 00:42:41,200
myself were like, yeah, but it’s
just a TV show.

714
00:42:41,400 –> 00:42:45,500
Yeah, like it’s not like it’s
just entertainment and it’s

715
00:42:45,500 –> 00:42:51,200
like, they’re not always Muslim
terrorists, like sure, 50%,

716
00:42:51,200 –> 00:42:54,100
right of the terrorist, the
first six seasons were Muslim.

717
00:42:54,500 –> 00:42:58,700
But look at season 7 and now
they’re moving on to fighting

718
00:42:58,700 –> 00:43:00,700
black people now that Obama’s in
office.

719
00:43:00,700 –> 00:43:06,000
Oh no.
Oh no, but even season two, it

720
00:43:06,000 –> 00:43:10,400
started even for me who I was a
fan of the show from an

721
00:43:10,400 –> 00:43:13,700
entertainment standpoint.
It started to become kind of a

722
00:43:13,700 –> 00:43:15,700
hatewatch thing.
Sure.

723
00:43:15,700 –> 00:43:19,700
Because I recognize this was a
premise that could not sustain

724
00:43:19,700 –> 00:43:24,200
that many seasons and you know,
that in season 2 when Kim Bauer

725
00:43:24,300 –> 00:43:26,900
Art’s getting stalked by a
cougar, right?

726
00:43:26,900 –> 00:43:30,700
Of course, like she like she
gets kidnapped by an animal and

727
00:43:30,700 –> 00:43:33,300
that season 2.
After she’s already been

728
00:43:33,300 –> 00:43:37,700
kidnapped once and I think she’s
got two more kidnappings in her

729
00:43:37,700 –> 00:43:41,000
future.
Yeah, but even then the show

730
00:43:41,000 –> 00:43:44,800
felt entertaining because it
felt stupid, right.

731
00:43:44,900 –> 00:43:47,000
But then all these years
removed.

732
00:43:47,000 –> 00:43:49,400
It’s like, oh, yeah, it wasn’t
stupid.

733
00:43:49,400 –> 00:43:53,000
That’s why Abu ghraib happened.
Yeah, I get it now.

734
00:43:53,300 –> 00:43:54,200
Yeah.
Like this show.

735
00:43:54,400 –> 00:43:56,200
Didn’t come back.
There’s no no.

736
00:43:56,200 –> 00:43:58,000
Definitely.
Shouldn’t come for this show to

737
00:43:58,000 –> 00:44:01,500
come back.
Like absolutely not know what

738
00:44:01,500 –> 00:44:04,700
new is there to say here?
There’s nothing nothing.

739
00:44:04,700 –> 00:44:06,800
There was nothing new to say
that begin with.

740
00:44:06,800 –> 00:44:08,900
The only thing new is the
format.

741
00:44:08,900 –> 00:44:12,300
It was otherwise, the only way
the show would have gotten made,

742
00:44:12,400 –> 00:44:17,200
is if it had a revolutionary or,
you know, at least unique for

743
00:44:17,200 –> 00:44:21,900
the time gimmick.
Otherwise, it’s a very boring

744
00:44:21,900 –> 00:44:29,200
and cliche action.
Ian story and I love in the GQ

745
00:44:29,200 –> 00:44:34,800
interview with Jack Bauer.
He says, well, I think my story

746
00:44:34,800 –> 00:44:40,000
is not finished and that maybe
the next season should just

747
00:44:40,000 –> 00:44:44,400
involve them rescuing me from
like China or wherever I ended

748
00:44:44,400 –> 00:44:48,000
up and it’s like, you know, it
does sound very much like the

749
00:44:48,000 –> 00:44:52,100
United States to intervene in
China on your behalf and not the

750
00:44:52,100 –> 00:44:54,200
behalf of the millions of
Muslims.

751
00:44:54,600 –> 00:44:59,400
Wow, in re-education camps.
Yeah, this is like, so yeah,

752
00:44:59,400 –> 00:45:06,400
maybe maybe that is how 24 comes
back with us completely ignoring

753
00:45:06,600 –> 00:45:10,400
an entire tragedy.
Like we should go into Ukraine

754
00:45:10,700 –> 00:45:14,600
and just extract Jack.
Bauer sure.

755
00:45:14,700 –> 00:45:20,600
I might deal with nothing else,
like blinders on just get Jack,

756
00:45:20,600 –> 00:45:28,100
Bauer.
I as a devout 24 fan for years

757
00:45:28,100 –> 00:45:31,900
and years by like season.
For, if you look into it.

758
00:45:31,900 –> 00:45:35,400
There’s a big chorus of people
online, who by, like season for

759
00:45:35,400 –> 00:45:37,400
were like kill Jack, Bauer.
Yeah.

760
00:45:37,400 –> 00:45:41,900
That is how you fix this show.
Kill Jack, Bauer.

761
00:45:41,900 –> 00:45:46,500
And again, always seemed like it
was going to happen and it never

762
00:45:46,500 –> 00:45:49,300
happened.
Yeah, and that would have I

763
00:45:49,300 –> 00:45:52,800
think restored a little
respectability for this show.

764
00:45:53,300 –> 00:45:57,100
They took that turn because when
those military people showed up,

765
00:45:57,100 –> 00:45:58,800
they were like, you know, how
you fix this show?

766
00:45:58,800 –> 00:46:01,600
Show torture backfiring.
Yes.

767
00:46:01,700 –> 00:46:03,200
Yeah.
I like that note.

768
00:46:03,200 –> 00:46:06,800
It’s a good that is just a good
creative note.

769
00:46:07,000 –> 00:46:09,000
Yeah, worth it more than
anything else.

770
00:46:09,000 –> 00:46:11,900
Like talk.
They just put it was just their

771
00:46:11,900 –> 00:46:16,000
responses of funny because they
just can’t even conceive of any

772
00:46:16,000 –> 00:46:20,700
narrative that could follow from
that even though it opens up so

773
00:46:20,700 –> 00:46:22,800
many new narrative spaces.
Yeah.

774
00:46:23,200 –> 00:46:27,100
But like they are interested in,
you know, actually being

775
00:46:27,100 –> 00:46:29,700
creative.
Yeah, like it’s funny that that

776
00:46:29,700 –> 00:46:32,900
would pop like that kind of a
sentiment would pop up starting

777
00:46:33,000 –> 00:46:36,900
like around season for because
like that’s around when lost is

778
00:46:36,900 –> 00:46:41,200
out and kinda up in the game as
far as narrative

779
00:46:41,200 –> 00:46:46,300
interestingness, and so probably
did have a lot to do with it.

780
00:46:46,400 –> 00:46:51,100
Yeah, they were competitors in,
many ways and also George Bush.

781
00:46:51,500 –> 00:46:54,600
I mean, I guess, just because of
my age, George Bush is the

782
00:46:54,600 –> 00:46:58,400
person who I don’t think
radicalized me is the right

783
00:46:58,400 –> 00:47:00,900
word.
But no, but George Bush is the

784
00:47:00,900 –> 00:47:04,000
reason I got into politics, like
the 2000 election.

785
00:47:04,000 –> 00:47:06,900
I was like, well, that’s not how
that was supposed to go.

786
00:47:07,000 –> 00:47:10,500
Yes, it all and then everything
followed from there, but by

787
00:47:10,500 –> 00:47:15,200
like, when 24 premiered 9/11 had
just happened, and I was like,

788
00:47:15,200 –> 00:47:16,100
all right.
Well sucks out.

789
00:47:16,100 –> 00:47:19,400
George Bush took power, but he’s
hopefully going to deal with

790
00:47:19,400 –> 00:47:22,600
this properly as any respectable
American.

791
00:47:23,100 –> 00:47:27,800
It should sure.
And so I liked 24 that first

792
00:47:27,800 –> 00:47:33,000
season but my enjoyment of it
waned, as my understanding of

793
00:47:33,000 –> 00:47:36,300
what the Bush Administration was
doing, totally just became a

794
00:47:36,308 –> 00:47:38,900
thing.
Like I stuck with it to the end,

795
00:47:38,900 –> 00:47:41,900
but it became like The Walking
Dead where eventually I was just

796
00:47:41,900 –> 00:47:45,500
like hate watching it because it
made me so mad.

797
00:47:45,500 –> 00:47:50,700
But 24 made me mad in like a
global way.

798
00:47:50,700 –> 00:47:53,000
Like I just hate the way I hit
the right.

799
00:47:53,200 –> 00:47:57,800
Hang on The Walking Dead, right?
Yeah. 24 was ruining the world.

800
00:47:58,300 –> 00:48:01,200
Yeah, and eventually yeah, it
was just a commercial for

801
00:48:01,300 –> 00:48:02,500
torture.
Yeah.

802
00:48:02,500 –> 00:48:06,300
I mean that seemed to be the
that was the vibe that I got

803
00:48:06,300 –> 00:48:11,100
from my very basic overview.
Watch that I did over the last

804
00:48:11,100 –> 00:48:15,900
day of dying.
I watched a couple Seasons like

805
00:48:15,900 –> 00:48:21,200
episodes throughout the series.
Like I watched the first season

806
00:48:21,200 –> 00:48:22,900
premiere in the second season
premiere.

807
00:48:23,100 –> 00:48:26,100
And I watched a recap of every
season like a little three

808
00:48:26,100 –> 00:48:32,000
minute recap per season, and
then we have we also watch the

809
00:48:32,100 –> 00:48:35,400
quote-unquote movie, 24
Redemption.

810
00:48:35,400 –> 00:48:39,000
I was just going to say speaking
of Recaps, that is our next

811
00:48:39,000 –> 00:48:41,100
episode.
I’ll be honest episode.

812
00:48:41,200 –> 00:48:46,600
We’re going to dive into a
really interesting moment in 24

813
00:48:46,600 –> 00:48:50,300
history.
It’s a TV movie called 24

814
00:48:50,300 –> 00:48:53,000
Redemption, and what’s
interesting about it.

815
00:48:53,200 –> 00:48:58,100
Is there not that far removed?
From winning an Emmy for best

816
00:48:58,200 –> 00:49:01,300
Primetime, drama, but also there
at the point where people are

817
00:49:01,300 –> 00:49:05,700
like this shows stupid like
where this isn’t how the world

818
00:49:05,700 –> 00:49:11,100
thinks about terrorism anymore.
This is irresponsible and dumb

819
00:49:11,400 –> 00:49:14,900
Obama is about to get elected.
What are you doing?

820
00:49:15,200 –> 00:49:18,100
And they’re like, all right.
What if Jack Bauer starts

821
00:49:18,100 –> 00:49:19,400
killing black people?
Next?

822
00:49:19,400 –> 00:49:21,600
Yeah.
Well, did you like that better?

823
00:49:22,000 –> 00:49:26,100
Italy is also.
So it also seemed like as it got

824
00:49:26,100 –> 00:49:30,800
closer to a Democrat being
elected, even if they didn’t

825
00:49:30,800 –> 00:49:34,800
know, it was going to be Obama.
At the time, the show started to

826
00:49:34,800 –> 00:49:39,800
lean a lot harder into elements
within the federal government

827
00:49:39,800 –> 00:49:44,000
are like the high levels of the
federal government are the bad

828
00:49:44,000 –> 00:49:47,600
guys.
Like the cabal you might say

829
00:49:47,900 –> 00:49:52,400
among the high-ranking,
government officials up to the

830
00:49:52,400 –> 00:49:55,600
White House.
Up to presidency and vice

831
00:49:55,600 –> 00:49:59,700
presidency are maybe the biggest
danger that be starts to become

832
00:49:59,700 –> 00:50:04,000
a very much bigger elements
towards 2007 to the hell.

833
00:50:04,000 –> 00:50:06,500
Yeah.
I know we are get.

834
00:50:06,500 –> 00:50:08,300
He’ll know why that might be.
I don’t know.

835
00:50:08,700 –> 00:50:11,900
Yeah, we should investigate that
further wonder what the

836
00:50:11,900 –> 00:50:14,200
background of the people who
made this show is.

837
00:50:14,200 –> 00:50:15,100
I know.
Yeah.

838
00:50:15,100 –> 00:50:21,300
Yeah, let’s look at Joel sir.
Now we’re interesting.

839
00:50:21,600 –> 00:50:25,300
Yeah, I remember watching.
Watching 24 Redemption when it

840
00:50:25,300 –> 00:50:28,100
came out.
And even then I was like, okay,

841
00:50:28,100 –> 00:50:30,400
this is like 24, but boring.
I get it.

842
00:50:31,100 –> 00:50:35,500
I guess what this is and then
like the whole series follow the

843
00:50:35,500 –> 00:50:40,200
the season 7 follows from 24
Redemption, but it’s yeah.

844
00:50:40,200 –> 00:50:43,800
It’s an interesting point that
shows history where they were

845
00:50:43,800 –> 00:50:48,600
really struggling for a reason
to still exist.

846
00:50:48,700 –> 00:50:53,000
Yeah, and I feel like they feel
like they threw a knuckleball.

847
00:50:53,100 –> 00:50:56,000
Where they were like, okay, but
this year, Jack Bauer’s

848
00:50:56,100 –> 00:50:58,500
protecting black children,
right?

849
00:50:58,500 –> 00:51:01,600
And it’s like, no, he’s Bowers
mowing down Africans with a

850
00:51:01,607 –> 00:51:06,100
machine gun, right?
It’s waving a white lie is doing

851
00:51:06,200 –> 00:51:10,100
and he’s saving 14 children.
While millions are going to

852
00:51:10,100 –> 00:51:13,100
perish for sure.
But yeah, let’s check out season

853
00:51:13,100 –> 00:51:15,900
7 2015.
It’s also interesting.

854
00:51:15,900 –> 00:51:19,100
I did want to talk about the
Atlantic piece.

855
00:51:19,400 –> 00:51:22,200
That was like a retrospective
that you that you sent.

856
00:51:22,300 –> 00:51:26,400
Yeah.
Where it talks about 24 as being

857
00:51:26,600 –> 00:51:32,000
the most influential TV drama of
all time, it’s nuts because

858
00:51:32,000 –> 00:51:35,800
says, there isn’t even a close
second, which is an insane.

859
00:51:36,200 –> 00:51:38,100
And then later on in the
article.

860
00:51:38,100 –> 00:51:42,000
It says no other Drama Series
has even tried to tell the story

861
00:51:42,000 –> 00:51:45,000
in real time.
Makes it seem like maybe it

862
00:51:45,000 –> 00:51:49,300
wasn’t like the most influential
Series in television history,

863
00:51:49,400 –> 00:51:53,700
because, you know, what show had
a lot of people trying Imitated

864
00:51:53,700 –> 00:51:59,800
exact formula lost there were
fucking billion, lost ripoffs.

865
00:51:59,800 –> 00:52:02,500
And they’re like, I keep their.
I also can’t think of another

866
00:52:02,500 –> 00:52:07,000
real-time show because it’s a
bad idea is, the problem is

867
00:52:07,000 –> 00:52:10,700
calling it.
The most influential show in

868
00:52:10,700 –> 00:52:15,000
history is like calling Kurt
Cobain’s suicide, the most

869
00:52:15,000 –> 00:52:18,500
influential suicide in history
because there were lots of

870
00:52:18,500 –> 00:52:21,800
copycats.
Yeah, but that’s not good.

871
00:52:21,900 –> 00:52:25,400
And the people who were
Influenced by 24 where the

872
00:52:25,408 –> 00:52:27,500
people who were out fucking
torturing people.

873
00:52:27,500 –> 00:52:29,800
Exactly.
Like, that’s not the kind of

874
00:52:29,800 –> 00:52:32,100
influence.
You want, right?

875
00:52:32,100 –> 00:52:36,700
From a fucking movie.
Yeah, last just made people make

876
00:52:36,700 –> 00:52:40,100
their shows weird.
Yeah, it made it harder or made

877
00:52:40,100 –> 00:52:45,200
soldiers, gouge people, right?
Jugular veins out lost revived

878
00:52:45,200 –> 00:52:49,600
interest in genre elements in TV
soap, operas.

879
00:52:50,200 –> 00:52:52,900
That’s what caustic?
That article even.

880
00:52:53,100 –> 00:52:57,400
Kind of throws lost under the
bus at, what does it does at one

881
00:52:57,400 –> 00:53:00,800
point?
But more than that, even I have

882
00:53:00,800 –> 00:53:02,600
to highlight this quote.
I am.

883
00:53:02,600 –> 00:53:06,900
So this is one of the craziest
things I want to point out.

884
00:53:06,900 –> 00:53:11,900
I, we have to give credit to
Hampton Stevens, a contributing

885
00:53:11,900 –> 00:53:19,800
writer to the Atlantic in 2010.
Wrote this paragraph from day,

886
00:53:19,800 –> 00:53:24,700
one pun intended, 24 has had And
impeccable casting, with a

887
00:53:24,700 –> 00:53:28,600
Litany of hyper talented guest
stars, including Dennis Hopper

888
00:53:28,700 –> 00:53:33,900
Powers Boothe, James cron, Mi
Anil, Kapoor, Jon Voight and

889
00:53:33,900 –> 00:53:36,000
kurtwood Smith, and we can’t
forget.

890
00:53:36,000 –> 00:53:39,300
Dennis Haysbert yet.
Another example of the show’s

891
00:53:39,300 –> 00:53:43,100
stunning cultural?
Reach Hayes, Birds charismatic,

892
00:53:43,100 –> 00:53:47,500
morally, unimpeachable,
president David Palmer help the

893
00:53:47,500 –> 00:53:52,400
American people get comfortable
with an African-American as

894
00:53:52,400 –> 00:53:54,500
president.
Of the United States.

895
00:53:54,600 –> 00:54:01,500
If there had never been a 24, it
is entirely possible that Barack

896
00:54:01,600 –> 00:54:04,600
Obama might not have been
elected.

897
00:54:05,900 –> 00:54:09,300
And irony, surely not lost on
the show’s staunchly

898
00:54:09,300 –> 00:54:12,500
conservative creators.
That is amazing.

899
00:54:12,500 –> 00:54:16,900
Yeah, 2424 did it.
That’s what got Obama elected.

900
00:54:16,900 –> 00:54:19,200
Thanks.
It’s 24 for winning the war on

901
00:54:19,200 –> 00:54:22,100
terror and getting Obama elected
if it’s all him.

902
00:54:22,500 –> 00:54:25,000
Wow.
Wow, cool.

903
00:54:25,000 –> 00:54:30,000
In particular is nuts.
There’s also a part where like

904
00:54:30,000 –> 00:54:32,300
I’m going to paraphrase, but
he’s just straight up.

905
00:54:32,300 –> 00:54:34,600
Like, yeah, people were mad
about all the torture.

906
00:54:34,600 –> 00:54:36,400
But how about that
cinematography?

907
00:54:36,400 –> 00:54:38,100
Am I right?
Right.

908
00:54:38,100 –> 00:54:41,300
Like, if they made it look so
good and it’s yeah, like, he

909
00:54:41,300 –> 00:54:45,900
literally says the
cinematography is lost in the

910
00:54:45,900 –> 00:54:49,600
debate, about the torture and
it’s like because that like you

911
00:54:49,600 –> 00:54:52,100
don’t get to go, but it looks so
good.

912
00:54:52,300 –> 00:54:56,700
The looks great.
Yes, and also the cinematography

913
00:54:57,000 –> 00:55:00,000
looks like Nash Bridges with
shaky cam.

914
00:55:00,000 –> 00:55:01,900
Yeah, it looks like a Fox TV
show.

915
00:55:02,400 –> 00:55:06,700
It looked terrible.
Yeah, it’s I don’t know.

916
00:55:07,000 –> 00:55:11,800
I feel like I should be canceled
for watching as much 24 as I did

917
00:55:11,800 –> 00:55:14,400
like know.
I know that was the thing.

918
00:55:14,400 –> 00:55:16,800
Yeah, about the Bush
Administration though.

919
00:55:16,800 –> 00:55:18,300
That’s the thing.
Like yeah.

920
00:55:18,300 –> 00:55:20,800
It was like, we also can’t
ignore the fact that was like

921
00:55:20,800 –> 00:55:22,900
the biggest show on television,
right?

922
00:55:23,000 –> 00:55:24,100
Right.
Yeah, one of them.

923
00:55:24,100 –> 00:55:27,400
This was pre streaming, there
weren’t as many options like

924
00:55:27,400 –> 00:55:31,500
we’ve been talking about.
It was really kind of a dawn of

925
00:55:31,500 –> 00:55:34,100
when people were like, oh TV
shows can be something

926
00:55:34,100 –> 00:55:37,100
different, totally and then it
took like six months for us to

927
00:55:37,100 –> 00:55:39,300
be like, okay.
Well, it shouldn’t be that but

928
00:55:39,300 –> 00:55:42,800
no, yeah, we should be something
into like a cool idea, but you

929
00:55:42,800 –> 00:55:45,300
turned the corner.
You shouldn’t have turned and

930
00:55:45,300 –> 00:55:48,000
then from there like Breaking
Bad and all the wire and all

931
00:55:48,000 –> 00:55:51,300
this other stuff.
Well, yeah, this is all pre the

932
00:55:51,300 –> 00:55:56,600
expansion.
Of cable as a destiny, you know,

933
00:55:56,700 –> 00:56:01,100
The Sopranos was just beginning
the year before, I really do

934
00:56:01,100 –> 00:56:04,600
slip in that first season kind
of under the radar.

935
00:56:04,600 –> 00:56:08,300
Sure.
Because it’s not about Muslim

936
00:56:08,300 –> 00:56:10,300
terrorists.
It’s Slobodan.

937
00:56:10,300 –> 00:56:13,100
Milosevic has boys right coming
to kidnap.

938
00:56:13,100 –> 00:56:15,300
Jack, Bauer’s daughter, and it’s
like, well, I don’t give a shit.

939
00:56:15,300 –> 00:56:19,800
If that happens, right?
It could very easily have been a

940
00:56:19,808 –> 00:56:22,800
die-hard TV show like it’s very
similar.

941
00:56:23,000 –> 00:56:28,200
Our Vibe take on like, you know,
the whole Die Hard To Die Hard

942
00:56:28,200 –> 00:56:32,100
with a Vengeance thing.
Like, it has a Vibe like that.

943
00:56:32,100 –> 00:56:36,000
Just poorly done.
It’s interesting that were

944
00:56:36,000 –> 00:56:40,900
covering this this week because
also, this week on the on pops

945
00:56:40,900 –> 00:56:44,000
Network on one of the bonus
podcast we run which is called

946
00:56:44,000 –> 00:56:46,300
pod.
Six a podcast about films of

947
00:56:46,300 –> 00:56:47,200
Spike.
Lee.

948
00:56:47,500 –> 00:56:49,500
We’re talking about the 25th
hour.

949
00:56:49,600 –> 00:56:52,900
Yeah, if you read up on the
25th, hour.the things people.

950
00:56:53,000 –> 00:56:56,400
About it now is mainly what a
great 911 movie.

951
00:56:56,700 –> 00:57:01,000
Yeah, because it was being
filmed, when 9/11 happened just

952
00:57:01,000 –> 00:57:04,600
like 24, right?
And those two projects, take

953
00:57:04,600 –> 00:57:08,400
very Divergent paths.
Yeah, when it comes to 911

954
00:57:08,400 –> 00:57:12,800
because Spike Lee had this whole
script that had been written

955
00:57:12,800 –> 00:57:15,500
before he got it.
It was based on a book and then

956
00:57:15,500 –> 00:57:18,300
9/11 happens and he’s filming a
movie based in New York and he’s

957
00:57:18,300 –> 00:57:19,900
like, well, how do I handle
this?

958
00:57:19,900 –> 00:57:22,100
Do I act like it never happened,
right?

959
00:57:22,100 –> 00:57:25,900
Do I?
Exploit it, and he handles it.

960
00:57:25,900 –> 00:57:30,300
So Tastefully, yeah, I really
loved that movie.

961
00:57:30,300 –> 00:57:32,600
I haven’t, I’ve been wanting to
re-watch it.

962
00:57:32,800 –> 00:57:34,900
He handles 911.
Really?

963
00:57:34,900 –> 00:57:38,100
Well, not surprisingly like,
yeah, it’s Spike Lee.

964
00:57:38,100 –> 00:57:40,700
He’s from New York.
Yeah, of course.

965
00:57:40,700 –> 00:57:43,400
He did a great job with it and
people fucking love that movie

966
00:57:43,400 –> 00:57:45,000
for it.
This is the same thing.

967
00:57:45,000 –> 00:57:46,700
But in the opposite direction,
right?

968
00:57:46,700 –> 00:57:49,500
Yeah. 911 happened, while they
were making this movie, and they

969
00:57:49,500 –> 00:57:51,500
were like, all right.
What do we do next?

970
00:57:51,500 –> 00:57:52,900
I got it.
How about we?

971
00:57:53,000 –> 00:57:56,300
Exploit 911 for the benefit of
the American government and

972
00:57:56,300 –> 00:58:00,400
their desire to torture Muslims
in the Middle East and for our

973
00:58:00,400 –> 00:58:06,300
monetary benefit and emotional
catharsis in a very bad way.

974
00:58:06,400 –> 00:58:10,900
Yeah, this this show, I hope
there comes a point in American

975
00:58:10,900 –> 00:58:13,500
history where we look back on
this show and we’re like, we

976
00:58:13,500 –> 00:58:16,500
should be ashamed.
Like yeah, like, what were we

977
00:58:16,500 –> 00:58:20,500
thinking allowing this?
And I don’t know that we’re

978
00:58:20,500 –> 00:58:22,800
going to get to that point, but
no one.

979
00:58:22,900 –> 00:58:27,300
Tiffany’s bad.
It was legitimately bad for the

980
00:58:27,300 –> 00:58:28,600
world.
And I hate that.

981
00:58:28,600 –> 00:58:31,600
I watched it.
It really is and it’s not good.

982
00:58:31,600 –> 00:58:36,500
Also, it’s like not exactly like
especially like holding.

983
00:58:36,700 –> 00:58:40,700
I can understand if you were at
the time, you know, entrenched

984
00:58:40,700 –> 00:58:45,000
in the bush era and also the the
television landscape of the

985
00:58:45,000 –> 00:58:48,300
time.
I can understand being a regular

986
00:58:48,300 –> 00:58:51,400
viewer of this even though even
at the time I found it

987
00:58:51,400 –> 00:58:54,400
repulsive.
Just from what little that I had

988
00:58:54,400 –> 00:58:57,100
seen of it.
Here’s what it is.

989
00:58:57,100 –> 00:59:00,600
If you and I think a lot of
people were able to do this at

990
00:59:00,600 –> 00:59:03,400
the time.
If you remove the impact, it’s

991
00:59:03,400 –> 00:59:07,000
having on the world from the
equation.

992
00:59:07,100 –> 00:59:12,400
It plays, like a horror movie
where those torture scenes, are

993
00:59:12,400 –> 00:59:16,100
the kills, right?
And Jack Bauer is Michael Myers

994
00:59:16,100 –> 00:59:21,400
or Jason Marquis and instead of
him slamming a person filled

995
00:59:21,400 –> 00:59:24,000
sleeping bag into a tree.
He’s shooting a guy’s wife in

996
00:59:24,000 –> 00:59:26,700
the knee and you’re like, holy
shit.

997
00:59:26,900 –> 00:59:30,500
Did you see what he did?
And that is what it was.

998
00:59:30,500 –> 00:59:32,800
If you yeah, get deep enough
into it.

999
00:59:32,800 –> 00:59:35,300
It was all.
So it’s all stupid and then

1000
00:59:35,300 –> 00:59:39,100
sometimes he’ll bite a guy in
the neck and you’re like, I

1001
00:59:39,100 –> 00:59:40,900
didn’t know how he was going to
escape.

1002
00:59:41,700 –> 00:59:43,700
I sense.
He didn’t have any other options

1003
00:59:43,900 –> 00:59:46,500
like and not the harp on these
sorts of things.

1004
00:59:46,500 –> 00:59:49,800
Because, but like, the whole
thing about the torture, like in

1005
00:59:49,800 –> 00:59:54,100
one of the episodes that I
watched, he like, Walks into a

1006
00:59:54,100 –> 01:00:01,300
room and he is like, he like, I
think he shoots somebody and

1007
01:00:01,300 –> 01:00:04,600
he’s like, I’m gonna keep
hurting you until you tell me

1008
01:00:04,700 –> 01:00:09,800
the right answer, like it until
you tell me something I can use

1009
01:00:09,800 –> 01:00:14,100
and then he hurts him and then
the guy is like, that’s it.

1010
01:00:14,100 –> 01:00:18,000
I told you everything I know and
he’s like, you know, he’s like,

1011
01:00:18,000 –> 01:00:20,500
you have no more useful
information for me and then

1012
01:00:20,500 –> 01:00:24,100
kills him.
And it’s like so So let’s look

1013
01:00:24,100 –> 01:00:29,000
at this, just from a just like
step back from like the emotions

1014
01:00:29,000 –> 01:00:33,000
of either side and look at this
from a tactical standpoint.

1015
01:00:33,100 –> 01:00:37,300
We’re to saying we’re going to
hurt you until you tell us

1016
01:00:37,400 –> 01:00:41,000
everything that you know, and
then we’re still going to kill

1017
01:00:41,000 –> 01:00:43,600
you.
After you have told us all of

1018
01:00:43,600 –> 01:00:47,100
the like then where is the
actual incentive for someone to

1019
01:00:47,100 –> 01:00:50,500
be honest with you?
And I know this might seem like

1020
01:00:50,500 –> 01:00:55,000
a weird angle to suggest but The
terrorists are watching this.

1021
01:00:55,100 –> 01:00:57,900
Sure does.
Like we know how other countries

1022
01:00:57,900 –> 01:01:00,700
take American Media.
Like I guarantee you there were

1023
01:01:00,700 –> 01:01:03,200
Muslim country seeing this and
being like yeah.

1024
01:01:03,400 –> 01:01:07,400
Oh, so this is how it’s going to
work like yeah, if I tell you

1025
01:01:07,400 –> 01:01:09,100
what you want to know, you’re
still going to kill me.

1026
01:01:09,300 –> 01:01:13,300
Well, then I’m just not going to
tell you like in this it was

1027
01:01:13,300 –> 01:01:18,100
like propaganda on both sides
that like, yeah, was kind of

1028
01:01:18,100 –> 01:01:22,800
counterproductive on both sides.
It like if you happen to be a

1029
01:01:22,900 –> 01:01:25,400
Person who is going to be
interrogated and watch this.

1030
01:01:25,600 –> 01:01:28,300
You’d be like, all right.
Well, I guess I’m just going to

1031
01:01:28,300 –> 01:01:30,500
get murdered as quickly as
possible.

1032
01:01:30,800 –> 01:01:34,100
Well, and it turns out that
that’s something that the

1033
01:01:34,100 –> 01:01:38,800
experts in that meeting talked
about, as being like, this is

1034
01:01:38,800 –> 01:01:42,100
just what happened, you know,
think about, think about what,

1035
01:01:42,100 –> 01:01:44,700
our idealized version of the
American League.

1036
01:01:44,700 –> 01:01:47,300
This happens in the episode that
we’re going to talk about.

1037
01:01:47,300 –> 01:01:51,000
But like, whenever we have a
story about an American being

1038
01:01:51,000 –> 01:01:55,700
tortured for information, Heroic
American would always rather

1039
01:01:55,800 –> 01:01:59,100
take whatever punishment you can
give and we’ll never break

1040
01:01:59,100 –> 01:02:04,100
because their resolve is so
strong that they could never be

1041
01:02:04,100 –> 01:02:08,300
convinced by torture, but we’re
just saying that that’s not

1042
01:02:08,300 –> 01:02:12,500
going to happen the other way.
I mean clearly it will that’s

1043
01:02:12,500 –> 01:02:14,900
human nature.
We if you especially if you’re

1044
01:02:14,900 –> 01:02:18,400
in trenched in an ideology
punishment is not gonna it’s

1045
01:02:18,400 –> 01:02:22,100
just going to reinforce it and
especially if you’re talking

1046
01:02:22,100 –> 01:02:25,000
about.
Fundamentalist.

1047
01:02:25,000 –> 01:02:28,200
Yeah, right.
Well, absolutely die.

1048
01:02:28,200 –> 01:02:31,100
For their religion.
So being like, I’m gonna murder

1049
01:02:31,100 –> 01:02:37,100
you, you like, and there’s so
many examples of actual torture

1050
01:02:37,100 –> 01:02:38,800
where the people in question
were, like.

1051
01:02:38,900 –> 01:02:40,400
Yeah.
I told them what they wanted to

1052
01:02:40,400 –> 01:02:42,500
know.
So there’s stop torturing me,

1053
01:02:42,500 –> 01:02:46,600
but I wasn’t telling the truth,
of course, ended up being shitty

1054
01:02:47,000 –> 01:02:50,800
information, that just probably
set everything back even more.

1055
01:02:50,800 –> 01:02:53,600
But right, you know, they
stopped, I mean, And bamboo

1056
01:02:53,600 –> 01:02:57,400
shoots up my dick hole and
that’s the thing that, you know,

1057
01:02:57,500 –> 01:03:01,000
Zero Dark Thirty, which is a
film that has its own problems

1058
01:03:01,000 –> 01:03:04,900
and many ways.
But one of its biggest strengths

1059
01:03:04,900 –> 01:03:12,100
is that it dramatizes that part
of torture where it’s almost

1060
01:03:12,100 –> 01:03:16,800
like not only do you get bad
information from the person that

1061
01:03:16,800 –> 01:03:20,800
you tortured if you get anything
at all, but then that bad

1062
01:03:20,800 –> 01:03:25,400
information can cause you to
waste Waste time and resources

1063
01:03:25,400 –> 01:03:29,300
tracking down a false lead.
That is just going to waste

1064
01:03:29,300 –> 01:03:33,400
everyone’s time and could lead
to casualties or whatever.

1065
01:03:33,400 –> 01:03:37,900
Kill Jack, Bauer.
God, please, for back for a

1066
01:03:37,900 –> 01:03:40,800
three-minute tick, tock video.
Jack.

1067
01:03:40,800 –> 01:03:45,500
Bauer is killed for his crimes.
And then, oh my God, I could

1068
01:03:45,500 –> 01:03:46,600
deal with that.
That would be.

1069
01:03:46,600 –> 01:03:49,300
Yeah, I’d be into it.
But beyond that.

1070
01:03:49,300 –> 01:03:51,300
Stop it.
The time has passed.

1071
01:03:51,300 –> 01:03:55,200
We cannot bring back Jack.
Our in 2022.

1072
01:03:55,300 –> 01:03:59,100
Don’t be fucking silly.
I mean, the bright side is no

1073
01:03:59,100 –> 01:04:01,300
one would watch it.
Like, I don’t write.

1074
01:04:01,300 –> 01:04:05,100
Remember the last time watch,
well, box show the honestly, I

1075
01:04:05,100 –> 01:04:09,100
would say the biggest problem to
bring back 24 in the modern

1076
01:04:09,100 –> 01:04:12,000
television landscape.
Is that literally the only

1077
01:04:12,000 –> 01:04:14,800
reason the show was made is
because a season order of

1078
01:04:14,800 –> 01:04:18,500
Television was 24 episodes.
And that is not the case

1079
01:04:18,500 –> 01:04:21,300
anymore.
Yeah, they would only get 12 or

1080
01:04:21,300 –> 01:04:24,700
maybe 13.
Odes and then your mess.

1081
01:04:24,700 –> 01:04:27,500
Like that’s what happened with
Redemption and that’s messing

1082
01:04:27,500 –> 01:04:32,900
with your fundamental premise
hear me out 64, our episodes.

1083
01:04:33,400 –> 01:04:35,500
Thank you.
I would like that green light

1084
01:04:35,500 –> 01:04:39,100
and no Olivia and I are going to
write that.

1085
01:04:39,100 –> 01:04:44,000
I actually now that I think
about it, if you did 12 movie

1086
01:04:44,000 –> 01:04:46,600
length episodes, I’m not even
kidding.

1087
01:04:46,700 –> 01:04:49,200
Like, that might be what they
would pitch.

1088
01:04:49,300 –> 01:04:52,400
I mean is like that’s what a lot
of these shows are now that yeah

1089
01:04:52,400 –> 01:04:54,500
event.
Anna show is great

1090
01:04:54,500 –> 01:04:58,800
hour-and-a-half episodes, right?
And that was a film franchise.

1091
01:04:58,800 –> 01:05:02,800
Yeah, maniacs.
And that would equal 24:41

1092
01:05:03,400 –> 01:05:06,700
minute episodes, but also don’t
do that.

1093
01:05:06,700 –> 01:05:11,300
No bad, bad, that bad.
Just kill Jack, Bauer I think

1094
01:05:11,300 –> 01:05:13,900
idea.
We have written the final season

1095
01:05:13,900 –> 01:05:17,000
of 24 3 minutes, long.
Jack.

1096
01:05:17,000 –> 01:05:20,900
Bauer is a is murdered for his
crimes execute.

1097
01:05:20,900 –> 01:05:24,600
Sorry, I do think.
Disney owns Jack Bauer.

1098
01:05:24,600 –> 01:05:29,200
It’s one of the many bizarre
things that Disney now owns is

1099
01:05:29,200 –> 01:05:31,800
Jack Bauer.
Oh no, ha ha ha.

1100
01:05:32,700 –> 01:05:35,300
So I think that’s going to
prevent it.

1101
01:05:35,300 –> 01:05:38,800
I don’t think Disney is gonna
want to make 24.

1102
01:05:39,000 –> 01:05:42,700
Fair are active talked since
late 2021 about bringing.

1103
01:05:42,700 –> 01:05:45,700
Yeah before, but I mean, look,
maybe I’ve been wrong about lots

1104
01:05:45,700 –> 01:05:48,600
of stuff.
So maybe they will but we’ll

1105
01:05:48,600 –> 01:05:50,600
see.
We’ll see if it goes through.

1106
01:05:50,600 –> 01:05:52,000
Yeah.
It depends on, who we invade

1107
01:05:52,000 –> 01:05:54,800
next.
I’m surprised right, 24 in

1108
01:05:54,800 –> 01:05:57,700
Venezuela.
Yeah, or he’s trained.

1109
01:05:57,700 –> 01:06:00,500
Try to make that work, like,
because there was that Jack Ryan

1110
01:06:00,500 –> 01:06:02,700
series and Venezuelan.
It’s like, right.

1111
01:06:02,700 –> 01:06:05,200
I remember that, that really
thought we were talking about

1112
01:06:05,200 –> 01:06:08,400
Wilds, whele, by now, huh?
That was crazy.

1113
01:06:08,700 –> 01:06:11,800
And yeah, I guess the next one
would be Jack.

1114
01:06:11,800 –> 01:06:16,000
Jack Bauer and Ukraine.
Yeah, or Russia.

1115
01:06:16,000 –> 01:06:18,600
They did Russia already once I
think.

1116
01:06:18,900 –> 01:06:20,500
Yes.
Yeah.

1117
01:06:20,500 –> 01:06:22,600
He’s been he’s been all over the
place.

1118
01:06:22,800 –> 01:06:25,500
Yeah, sees a world world
spanning guy.

1119
01:06:26,000 –> 01:06:27,500
I think that’s a good place to
end.

1120
01:06:27,500 –> 01:06:29,100
This episode were all
absolutely.

1121
01:06:29,100 –> 01:06:32,100
We’re all up in arms about 24
coming back.

1122
01:06:32,100 –> 01:06:35,400
Here’s hoping it doesn’t know,
it was just to drive home, the

1123
01:06:35,400 –> 01:06:38,700
fact that it shouldn’t on next
week’s bonus episode.

1124
01:06:38,700 –> 01:06:43,800
We’re just going to recap.
The soul attempt to make a 24

1125
01:06:43,800 –> 01:06:48,000
movie.
Yes, which was 24 Redemption.

1126
01:06:48,000 –> 01:06:52,500
It’s a television movie.
That was the prequel to Seasons.

1127
01:06:52,800 –> 01:06:57,200
Seven of 24.
Yeah, and it’s not good.

1128
01:06:57,500 –> 01:06:59,100
It’s bad.
No, no bad.

1129
01:06:59,100 –> 01:07:01,400
I good.
I Was a Very Bad episode of

1130
01:07:01,400 –> 01:07:03,400
Television.
I would say to I said, it’s real

1131
01:07:03,400 –> 01:07:05,700
podcast about it will be very
fun.

1132
01:07:05,900 –> 01:07:08,600
No, it’ll be great promise you
that until then.

1133
01:07:08,900 –> 01:07:11,500
Do we have anything to plug
before we get out of here?

1134
01:07:11,800 –> 01:07:12,800
Olivia?
How about you?

1135
01:07:13,100 –> 01:07:16,700
You can find me on Twitter and
letterbox that hi there.

1136
01:07:16,700 –> 01:07:20,300
Hide our.
Oh, I guess I should log 24,

1137
01:07:20,300 –> 01:07:22,300
Redemption.
I hadn’t even considered know

1138
01:07:22,300 –> 01:07:24,500
why you Wouldn’t.
It’s a TV movie.

1139
01:07:24,500 –> 01:07:27,800
So I guess I will.
So, will a one-star?

1140
01:07:27,800 –> 01:07:31,200
I would say.
Bad enough.

1141
01:07:31,400 –> 01:07:33,700
You can follow me on Twitter and
Instagram at Adam.

1142
01:07:33,700 –> 01:07:35,200
Todd Brown.
Let’s talk with one D.

1143
01:07:35,300 –> 01:07:37,800
And I think that’s it for now.
Let’s get the fuck out of here.

1144
01:07:37,800 –> 01:07:40,200
Olivia.
Say Good-Bye Baby.

1145
01:07:40,500 –> 01:07:41,700
Goodbye everybody.
We love you.